2014 Anger General Geatest of All Time: #22 selection

[Yuh]

I don't think wailua is biased in any way here, but I agree with what ripper said. His drop off is much more apparent than most because he has lost so much of his athleticism, which is a big part of what made him great. But he should also get props for adjusting his game accordingly and still being very effective and efficient in spite of it.

It helps his game greatly having his minutes managed and being rested quite a bit and not being the main focus of the defenses attention definitely helps his efficiency. That being said, you have to love guys who are able to adjust their games after losing heir athleticism, wade, kobe, paul, etc being able to find crafty ways to score and get their teammates involved speaks volume of their bball iq

Well we'll see what he does without those restrictions this year. I think he's gonna perform well, regardless. He may not be as efficient as he was before, but I think he's gonna surprise some people.

[wailuaFC]

I don't think wailua is biased in any way here, but I agree with what ripper said. His drop off is much more apparent than most because he has lost so much of his athleticism, which is a big part of what made him great. But he should also get props for adjusting his game accordingly and still being very effective and efficient in spite of it.

It helps his game greatly having his minutes managed and being rested quite a bit and not being the main focus of the defenses attention definitely helps his efficiency. That being said, you have to love guys who are able to adjust their games after losing heir athleticism, wade, kobe, paul, etc being able to find crafty ways to score and get their teammates involved speaks volume of their bball iq

Well we'll see what he does without those restrictions this year. I think he's gonna perform well, regardless. He may not be as efficient as he was before, but I think he's gonna surprise some people.

I too think he and bosh will have very good years, the heat will be a tough out in the playoffs as long as wade is healthy

[Yuh]

I don't think wailua is biased in any way here, but I agree with what ripper said. His drop off is much more apparent than most because he has lost so much of his athleticism, which is a big part of what made him great. But he should also get props for adjusting his game accordingly and still being very effective and efficient in spite of it.

He gets mad props for it, yuh. He's not being dismissed at all....but rather ppl are saying that he's not a lock for this spot. Others do have good cases for this spot.

I truly feel that these next few years will determine just how great Wade really is.

It's a strange thing to say possibly, but a post-athletic prime Wade without Lebron James needs to demonstrate that he's still a major impact guy. Too many times in the past 2 years, he was far from that. Was it the knees? His role? Lebron? We'll see....

It has mostly been the knees ever since he bypassed a major procedure at Marquette in order to get back on the floor for his team. That decision cost him in the long run, but I think he will surprise a lot of people in these next few years. My take on this is not so much that he's a "lock" here as much as it is that I just don't see a good enough argument for someone else over him.

[ripper76]

Its completely understandable why he had his drop off, but my problem is while many others that could be in this spot had a slow steady dropoff that produced good numbers late into their career (dirk, robinson, barkley) while wade dropped off significantly despite being having his minutes managed and playing alongside the best player in the game. I think wade will be on the list soon, but I just hold his short peak against him (also explains why I have players like KAJ, kobe, duncan, etc higher then most)

I think you're penalizing him for his recent production only because it's not as good as what he did at his peak. He shouldn't be penalized for there being a gap in his production with amazing being at the high end and very good being the low end. Those are still very good numbers and amazing efficiency.

There shouldn't be a big black mark against a player for only being very good at the tail end of his career simply because he used to be much better.

That's the thing: When you're elite, you shouldn't decline as sharp as he has in such a short time. If it were a steady decline then it would be a non-issue.

I get that he's got the knee issues. But it is what it is.

That argument makes no sense to me. A player isn't elite because his game declined when he got old? Sounds like looking for a way to keep him off the list. He didn't turn into a bum, he's still a top 3 player at his spot.

[Y2K]

I think you're penalizing him for his recent production only because it's not as good as what he did at his peak. He shouldn't be penalized for there being a gap in his production with amazing being at the high end and very good being the low end. Those are still very good numbers and amazing efficiency.

There shouldn't be a big black mark against a player for only being very good at the tail end of his career simply because he used to be much better.

That's the thing: When you're elite, you shouldn't decline as sharp as he has in such a short time. If it were a steady decline then it would be a non-issue.

I get that he's got the knee issues. But it is what it is.

That argument makes no sense to me. A player isn't elite because his game declined when he got old? Sounds like looking for a way to keep him off the list. He didn't turn into a bum, he's still a top 3 player at his spot.

Ripper, He's not old. He's 32. And he certainly wasn't old 3 seasons ago when his decline began.

And nobody is calling him a bum. But he's not what he was and it happened very quickly. That goes against having excellent longevity.

[ripper76]

That's the thing: When you're elite, you shouldn't decline as sharp as he has in such a short time. If it were a steady decline then it would be a non-issue.

I get that he's got the knee issues. But it is what it is.

That argument makes no sense to me. A player isn't elite because his game declined when he got old? Sounds like looking for a way to keep him off the list. He didn't turn into a bum, he's still a top 3 player at his spot.

Ripper, He's not old. He's 32. And he certainly wasn't old 3 seasons ago when his decline began.

And nobody is calling him a bum. But he's not what he was and it happened very quickly. That goes against having excellent longevity.

You're penalizing him for being so much better at his peak. That's silly.

[wailuaFC]

That argument makes no sense to me. A player isn't elite because his game declined when he got old? Sounds like looking for a way to keep him off the list. He didn't turn into a bum, he's still a top 3 player at his spot.

Ripper, He's not old. He's 32. And he certainly wasn't old 3 seasons ago when his decline began.

And nobody is calling him a bum. But he's not what he was and it happened very quickly. That goes against having excellent longevity.

You're penalizing him for being so much better at his peak. That's silly.

I'm not so much penalizing him for not being as good as he used to be, but more so crediting the other players for being able to maintain a higher level of play for longer

[Y2K]

That argument makes no sense to me. A player isn't elite because his game declined when he got old? Sounds like looking for a way to keep him off the list. He didn't turn into a bum, he's still a top 3 player at his spot.

Ripper, He's not old. He's 32. And he certainly wasn't old 3 seasons ago when his decline began.

And nobody is calling him a bum. But he's not what he was and it happened very quickly. That goes against having excellent longevity.

You're penalizing him for being so much better at his peak. That's silly.

I'm penalizing him for a short prime, as i do any other player. Why is that silly?

[Y2K]

Ripper, He's not old. He's 32. And he certainly wasn't old 3 seasons ago when his decline began.

And nobody is calling him a bum. But he's not what he was and it happened very quickly. That goes against having excellent longevity.

You're penalizing him for being so much better at his peak. That's silly.

I'm not so much penalizing him for not being as good as he used to be, but more so crediting the other players for being able to maintain a higher level of play for longer

And that's the bottom line.

[ripper76]

Ripper, He's not old. He's 32. And he certainly wasn't old 3 seasons ago when his decline began.

And nobody is calling him a bum. But he's not what he was and it happened very quickly. That goes against having excellent longevity.

You're penalizing him for being so much better at his peak. That's silly.

I'm not so much penalizing him for not being as good as he used to be, but more so crediting the other players for being able to maintain a higher level of play for longer

That's why it's reasonable to have Wade in the 20s instead of the teens.

[Y2K]

You're penalizing him for being so much better at his peak. That's silly.

I'm not so much penalizing him for not being as good as he used to be, but more so crediting the other players for being able to maintain a higher level of play for longer

That's why it's reasonable to have Wade in the 20s instead of the teens.

Ripper, he'll be picked in the 20s. Maybe this round. Maybe next round. Maybe pick #28. He's not falling out of the 20s. He's deserving of the selection this round. But others have strong cases as well. It's going to boil down to what one favors most.

[Yuh]

Everybody has their own things that they look at and use to tip the scales in one direction or the other. I think that after weighing them all out there still isn't a better case for someone else over him at this point on the list. He sustained his peak performance for enough time and has already done enough since then to merit inclusion at this point. I don't think everyone who disagrees with that is stupid or biased, but I believe they'd be wrong.

[wailuaFC]

You're penalizing him for being so much better at his peak. That's silly.

I'm not so much penalizing him for not being as good as he used to be, but more so crediting the other players for being able to maintain a higher level of play for longer

That's why it's reasonable to have Wade in the 20s instead of the teens.

He has a case to be picked here, but because of the the added emphasis of longevity in my own criteria I'm not voting for him right now.

[Y2K]

Everybody has their own things that they look at and use to tip the scales in one direction or the other. I think that after weighing them all out there still isn't a better case for someone else over him at this point on the list. He sustained his peak performance for enough time and has already done enough since then to merit inclusion at this point. I don't think everyone who disagrees with that is stupid or biased, but I believe they'd be wrong.

Nothing wrong with this post, yuh.

[wailuaFC]

Everybody has their own things that they look at and use to tip the scales in one direction or the other. I think that after weighing them all out there still isn't a better case for someone else over him at this point on the list. He sustained his peak performance for enough time and has already done enough since then to merit inclusion at this point. I don't think everyone who disagrees with that is stupid or biased, but I believe they'd be wrong.

And that's completely reasonable. There just is so little separating players now, it really just boils down to personal preference

[Da Stars.]

I just watched the Phantom call against Laimbeer during the 88 finals that cost the Pistons the title.

I hate them both. Give me Zeke.

[Deez]

Isaiah I'm his prime wasn't as good as wade

[dwcmwa]

PIPPEN!

What is wrong with you people voting for Wade? and I repeat Isiah or Dirk are not better than Scottie Pimpin.

Open your eyes.

[Havlicekstealsit]

PIPPEN!

What is wrong with you people voting for Wade? and I repeat Isiah or Dirk are not better than Scottie Pimpin.

Open your eyes.

Both of those guys were bonafide leaders of their teams. Quit trying to get a guy who spent a majority of his career as second fiddle into the top 25. Pippen's good but he never won shit without #23 by his side.

[elmouse03]

PIPPEN!

What is wrong with you people voting for Wade? and I repeat Isiah or Dirk are not better than Scottie Pimpin.

Open your eyes.

Both of those guys were bonafide leaders of their teams. Quit trying to get a guy who spent a majority of his career as second fiddle into the top 25. Pippen's good but he never won shit without #23 by his side.

I am a Bulls and Pippen fan and I agree with this. Pippen was great but I will take him as my 2nd option rather then my first option.