2014 Anger General Geatest of All Time: #22 selection

[Yuh]

You mentioned PER a couple of times touting Wade.

Do you think it's disconcerting that Wade's PER goes down in the playoffs from the regular season (25.3 - 22.7)... while Dirk Nowitzki's has gone up in the playoffs (23.5 - 24.2)?

Yeah, like... not at all. Kind of a ridiculous insinuation, to be honest. Like I said, we're looking for reasons here. If you honestly believe that Dirk upped his game for the playoffs more than Wade did I don't know what to tell you, but I think you know better than that. Wade's numbers in the playoffs only dropped after his knees started to really break down. At his peak, he carved up (like really carved up) some of the best defensive teams of his generation in the playoffs (teams like the Celtics and Pistons). I can post the numbers if you like.

Please do. Because it's critical that we compare both players (good and bad) for their careers in their entirety. Turns out Nowitzki has been one of the more noteworthy playoff performers of recent years.

He's averaged at least 23.4 ppg in the playoffs in 11 different seasons. He's been sneaky consistently good. Not quite at Duncan's level for longevity and quality... but pretty close.

And if we're taking the good AND the bad with each player... Wade played on a 67-loss team in his prime. Just saying...

2010 Boston Celtics (5th in overall DRtg, Lost NBA Finals in 7) vs. Miami Heat 1st Rd
This was the year right before LeBron joined the Heat, supposedly in large part because he felt that he could not get past the Celtics on his own with the Cavs.

Series Stats
Dwyane Wade - 33.2 PPG .564 FG 5.6 RPG 6.8 APG 1.6 SPG 1.6 BPG

Regular Season
Dwyane Wade - 26.6 PPG .476 FG 4.8 RPG 6.5 APG 1.8 SPG 1.1 BPG


2005 Detroit Pistons (3rd in overall DRtg, Lost NBA Finals in 7) vs. Miami Heat ECF

Series Stats
Dwyane Wade - 25.8 PPG .440 FG 4.5 RPG 4.3 APG 1.7 SPG 1.0 BPG
*(With the Heat up 3-1, Wade sustained an injury in Game 5 and had to miss Game 6 at Detroit. He wasn't the same afterwards. Detroit ended up winning the series in 7.)

Regular Season
Dwyane Wade - 24.1 PPG .478 FG 5.2 RPG 6.8 APG 1.6 SPG 1.1 BPG


2006 Detroit Pistons (5th in overall DRtg, Lost in ECF to MIA) vs. Miami Heat ECF

Series Stats
Dwyane Wade - 26.7 PPG .617 FG 5.2 RPG 5.5 APG 1.8 SPG 1.5 BPG

Regular Season
Dwyane Wade - 27.2 PPG .495 FG 5.7 RPG 6.7 APG 1.9 SPG 0.8 BPG


2006 Dallas Mavericks (11th in overall DRtg, Lost in NBA Finals) vs. Miami Heat

Series Stats
Dwyane Wade (Age 24) - 34.7 PPG .468 FG 7.8 RPG 3.8 APG 2.7 SPG 1.0 BPG
Dirk Nowitzki (Age 27) - 22.8 PPG .390 FG 10.8 RPG 2.5 APG 0.7 SPG 0.7 BPG
(Using age to indicate that both were in their relative primes)

Regular Season
Dwyane Wade - 27.2 PPG .495 FG 5.7 RPG 6.7 APG 1.9 SPG 0.8 BPG
Dirk Nowitzki - 26.6 PPG .480 FG 9.0 RPG 2.8 APG 0.7 SPG 1.0 BPG


So Wade, when they were both in their relative primes going head-to-head in the NBA Finals:
Had only 3 less RPG than Dirk Nowitzki. Yet, he scored nearly 12 more PPG, shot nearly 8 percentage points higher from the field, dished out more APG (expected), and even blocked more shots per game.

[Yuh]

You mentioned PER a couple of times touting Wade.

Do you think it's disconcerting that Wade's PER goes down in the playoffs from the regular season (25.3 - 22.7)... while Dirk Nowitzki's has gone up in the playoffs (23.5 - 24.2)?

Yeah, like... not at all. Kind of a ridiculous insinuation, to be honest. Like I said, we're looking for reasons here. If you honestly believe that Dirk upped his game for the playoffs more than Wade did I don't know what to tell you, but I think you know better than that. Wade's numbers in the playoffs only dropped after his knees started to really break down. At his peak, he carved up (like really carved up) some of the best defensive teams of his generation in the playoffs (teams like the Celtics and Pistons). I can post the numbers if you like.

Please do. Because it's critical that we compare both players (good and bad) for their careers in their entirety. Turns out Nowitzki has been one of the more noteworthy playoff performers of recent years.

He's averaged at least 23.4 ppg in the playoffs in 11 different seasons. He's been sneaky consistently good. Not quite at Duncan's level for longevity and quality... but pretty close.

And if we're taking the good AND the bad with each player... Wade played on a 67-loss team in his prime. Just saying...

How is that relevant to this discussion?

He was injured and still gutted out the season despite having the collective talent on his team of a D-League squad after they got rid of 35 year old Shaq who was pretty much useless at that point in his career.

[AbeVigodaLive]

Yeah, like... not at all. Kind of a ridiculous insinuation, to be honest. Like I said, we're looking for reasons here. If you honestly believe that Dirk upped his game for the playoffs more than Wade did I don't know what to tell you, but I think you know better than that. Wade's numbers in the playoffs only dropped after his knees started to really break down. At his peak, he carved up (like really carved up) some of the best defensive teams of his generation in the playoffs (teams like the Celtics and Pistons). I can post the numbers if you like.

Please do. Because it's critical that we compare both players (good and bad) for their careers in their entirety. Turns out Nowitzki has been one of the more noteworthy playoff performers of recent years.

He's averaged at least 23.4 ppg in the playoffs in 11 different seasons. He's been sneaky consistently good. Not quite at Duncan's level for longevity and quality... but pretty close.

And if we're taking the good AND the bad with each player... Wade played on a 67-loss team in his prime. Just saying...

2010 Boston Celtics (5th in overall DRtg, Lost NBA Finals in 7) vs. Miami Heat 1st Rd
This was the year right before LeBron joined the Heat, supposedly in large part because he felt that he could not get past the Celtics on his own with the Cavs.

Series Stats
Dwyane Wade - 33.2 PPG .564 FG 5.6 RPG 6.8 APG 1.6 SPG 1.6 BPG

Regular Season
Dwyane Wade - 26.6 PPG .476 FG 4.8 RPG 6.5 APG 1.8 SPG 1.1 BPG


2005 Detroit Pistons (3rd in overall DRtg, Lost NBA Finals in 7) vs. Miami Heat ECF

Series Stats
Dwyane Wade - 25.8 PPG .440 FG 4.5 RPG 4.3 APG 1.7 SPG 1.0 BPG
*(With the Heat up 3-1, Wade sustained an injury in Game 5 and had to miss Game 6 at Detroit. He wasn't the same afterwards. Detroit ended up winning the series in 7.)

Regular Season
Dwyane Wade - 24.1 PPG .478 FG 5.2 RPG 6.8 APG 1.6 SPG 1.1 BPG


2006 Detroit Pistons (5th in overall DRtg, Lost in ECF to MIA) vs. Miami Heat ECF

Series Stats
Dwyane Wade - 26.7 PPG .617 FG 5.2 RPG 5.5 APG 1.8 SPG 1.5 BPG

Regular Season
Dwyane Wade - 27.2 PPG .495 FG 5.7 RPG 6.7 APG 1.9 SPG 0.8 BPG


2006 Dallas Mavericks (11th in overall DRtg, Lost in NBA Finals) vs. Miami Heat

Series Stats
Dwyane Wade (Age 24) - 34.7 PPG .468 FG 7.8 RPG 3.8 APG 2.7 SPG 1.0 BPG
Dirk Nowitzki (Age 27) - 22.8 PPG .390 FG 10.8 RPG 2.5 APG 0.7 SPG 0.7 BPG
(Using age to indicate that both were in their relative primes)

Regular Season
Dwyane Wade - 27.2 PPG .495 FG 5.7 RPG 6.7 APG 1.9 SPG 0.8 BPG
Dirk Nowitzki - 26.6 PPG .480 FG 9.0 RPG 2.8 APG 0.7 SPG 1.0 BPG


So Wade, when they were both in their relative primes going head-to-head in the NBA Finals:
Had only 3 less RPG than Dirk Nowitzki. Yet, he scored nearly 12 more PPG, shot nearly 8 percentage points higher from the field, dished out more APG (expected), and even blocked more shots per game.

Did you really just cherry pick 4 playoff series?

[Y2K]

I am a little bit puzzled with the overwhelming love for Thomas. I can see a case for him but I would have him a little lower down.

There have been a number of posts forgetting that it wasn't Thomas against the Celtics, Bulls etc and personalizing matchups. Those Pistons were deep and talented with big and versatile front courts and another HOFer in the back court with him in Dumars.

I prefer both Wade and Dirk here over Thomas.

I'll vote Wade since it appears he has the best chance to overtake Thomas at this point.

So do I. But I'm not sold on taking Wade in this round either.

The round is still young so I'll wait to vote.

[Yuh]

And Dirk led his number 1 seed to a first round loss to an 8th seed in the same year he won MVP. Both players have had horrible failures, but Wade has had a lot more success.

So losing 67 games and missing the playoffs is as bad as winning 67 and then losing in the 1st round?

An argument could be made that's the Mavs result that season was worse in the greater scheme of things.

Miami lost 67 games in a rebuilding year where their 2nd best player player was Ricky Davis. The old players showed their age and broke down after winning the championship, Shaq was hurt and decided he didn't want to be there anymore, Wade was hurt and played 51 games. Every team goes through down years and once it was clear that team was done they pulled the plug.

Dirk just had an MVP season, his team was the number 1 seed and everyone thought it was finally their year to win it all. They got destroyed by the 8th seed in the first round.

Both are pretty bad.

Agreed. And I'd say Dirk and his team's failure was much more embarrassing when you consider all of the things you mentioned.

[Yuh]

So losing 67 games and missing the playoffs is as bad as winning 67 and then losing in the 1st round?

An argument could be made that's the Mavs result that season was worse in the greater scheme of things.

Miami lost 67 games in a rebuilding year where their 2nd best player player was Ricky Davis. The old players showed their age and broke down after winning the championship, Shaq was hurt and decided he didn't want to be there anymore, Wade was hurt and played 51 games. Every team goes through down years and once it was clear that team was done they pulled the plug.

Dirk just had an MVP season, his team was the number 1 seed and everyone thought it was finally their year to win it all. They got destroyed by the 8th seed in the first round.

Both are pretty bad.

Yeah. Every team does. But even when Nowitzki is hurt... and the Mavs are down... he still wills them to at least a .500 record. Wade as THE guy couldn't get his team to win even 20% of the time.

Has Dirk ever played with a guy like Michael Beasley or Ricky Davis as his 2nd best player?

[AbeVigodaLive]

Yeah, like... not at all. Kind of a ridiculous insinuation, to be honest. Like I said, we're looking for reasons here. If you honestly believe that Dirk upped his game for the playoffs more than Wade did I don't know what to tell you, but I think you know better than that. Wade's numbers in the playoffs only dropped after his knees started to really break down. At his peak, he carved up (like really carved up) some of the best defensive teams of his generation in the playoffs (teams like the Celtics and Pistons). I can post the numbers if you like.

Please do. Because it's critical that we compare both players (good and bad) for their careers in their entirety. Turns out Nowitzki has been one of the more noteworthy playoff performers of recent years.

He's averaged at least 23.4 ppg in the playoffs in 11 different seasons. He's been sneaky consistently good. Not quite at Duncan's level for longevity and quality... but pretty close.

And if we're taking the good AND the bad with each player... Wade played on a 67-loss team in his prime. Just saying...

How is that relevant to this discussion?

He was injured and still gutted out the season despite having the collective talent on his team of a D-League squad after they got rid of 35 year old Shaq who was pretty much useless at that point in his career.

ANY player in the top 30 or 40 should have a 67-loss season (under any circumstances) show up as a black mark on his resume. Wade may still be worthy of this spot with it... but it most certainly should be held against him.

15 - 67 is Philly 76ers level terrible. And, in the NBA, we're not seeing anybody else on the list who ever played on a team that bad, healthy or not... prime or not.

It's one of the biggest negatives against Wade. You can't wash that stink away... just because he has convenient excuses. Otherwise you have to let Dirk have his own share of excuses for 2007.

[ripper76]

Please do. Because it's critical that we compare both players (good and bad) for their careers in their entirety. Turns out Nowitzki has been one of the more noteworthy playoff performers of recent years.

He's averaged at least 23.4 ppg in the playoffs in 11 different seasons. He's been sneaky consistently good. Not quite at Duncan's level for longevity and quality... but pretty close.

And if we're taking the good AND the bad with each player... Wade played on a 67-loss team in his prime. Just saying...

2010 Boston Celtics (5th in overall DRtg, Lost NBA Finals in 7) vs. Miami Heat 1st Rd
This was the year right before LeBron joined the Heat, supposedly in large part because he felt that he could not get past the Celtics on his own with the Cavs.

Series Stats
Dwyane Wade - 33.2 PPG .564 FG 5.6 RPG 6.8 APG 1.6 SPG 1.6 BPG

Regular Season
Dwyane Wade - 26.6 PPG .476 FG 4.8 RPG 6.5 APG 1.8 SPG 1.1 BPG


2005 Detroit Pistons (3rd in overall DRtg, Lost NBA Finals in 7) vs. Miami Heat ECF

Series Stats
Dwyane Wade - 25.8 PPG .440 FG 4.5 RPG 4.3 APG 1.7 SPG 1.0 BPG
*(With the Heat up 3-1, Wade sustained an injury in Game 5 and had to miss Game 6 at Detroit. He wasn't the same afterwards. Detroit ended up winning the series in 7.)

Regular Season
Dwyane Wade - 24.1 PPG .478 FG 5.2 RPG 6.8 APG 1.6 SPG 1.1 BPG


2006 Detroit Pistons (5th in overall DRtg, Lost in ECF to MIA) vs. Miami Heat ECF

Series Stats
Dwyane Wade - 26.7 PPG .617 FG 5.2 RPG 5.5 APG 1.8 SPG 1.5 BPG

Regular Season
Dwyane Wade - 27.2 PPG .495 FG 5.7 RPG 6.7 APG 1.9 SPG 0.8 BPG


2006 Dallas Mavericks (11th in overall DRtg, Lost in NBA Finals) vs. Miami Heat

Series Stats
Dwyane Wade (Age 24) - 34.7 PPG .468 FG 7.8 RPG 3.8 APG 2.7 SPG 1.0 BPG
Dirk Nowitzki (Age 27) - 22.8 PPG .390 FG 10.8 RPG 2.5 APG 0.7 SPG 0.7 BPG
(Using age to indicate that both were in their relative primes)

Regular Season
Dwyane Wade - 27.2 PPG .495 FG 5.7 RPG 6.7 APG 1.9 SPG 0.8 BPG
Dirk Nowitzki - 26.6 PPG .480 FG 9.0 RPG 2.8 APG 0.7 SPG 1.0 BPG


So Wade, when they were both in their relative primes going head-to-head in the NBA Finals:
Had only 3 less RPG than Dirk Nowitzki. Yet, he scored nearly 12 more PPG, shot nearly 8 percentage points higher from the field, dished out more APG (expected), and even blocked more shots per game.

Did you really just cherry pick 4 playoff series?

yuh- "At his peak, he carved up (like really carved up) some of the best defensive teams of his generation in the playoffs (teams like the Celtics and Pistons). I can post the numbers if you like."

Abe- "Please do."

[Yuh]

Please do. Because it's critical that we compare both players (good and bad) for their careers in their entirety. Turns out Nowitzki has been one of the more noteworthy playoff performers of recent years.

He's averaged at least 23.4 ppg in the playoffs in 11 different seasons. He's been sneaky consistently good. Not quite at Duncan's level for longevity and quality... but pretty close.

And if we're taking the good AND the bad with each player... Wade played on a 67-loss team in his prime. Just saying...

2010 Boston Celtics (5th in overall DRtg, Lost NBA Finals in 7) vs. Miami Heat 1st Rd
This was the year right before LeBron joined the Heat, supposedly in large part because he felt that he could not get past the Celtics on his own with the Cavs.

Series Stats
Dwyane Wade - 33.2 PPG .564 FG 5.6 RPG 6.8 APG 1.6 SPG 1.6 BPG

Regular Season
Dwyane Wade - 26.6 PPG .476 FG 4.8 RPG 6.5 APG 1.8 SPG 1.1 BPG


2005 Detroit Pistons (3rd in overall DRtg, Lost NBA Finals in 7) vs. Miami Heat ECF

Series Stats
Dwyane Wade - 25.8 PPG .440 FG 4.5 RPG 4.3 APG 1.7 SPG 1.0 BPG
*(With the Heat up 3-1, Wade sustained an injury in Game 5 and had to miss Game 6 at Detroit. He wasn't the same afterwards. Detroit ended up winning the series in 7.)

Regular Season
Dwyane Wade - 24.1 PPG .478 FG 5.2 RPG 6.8 APG 1.6 SPG 1.1 BPG


2006 Detroit Pistons (5th in overall DRtg, Lost in ECF to MIA) vs. Miami Heat ECF

Series Stats
Dwyane Wade - 26.7 PPG .617 FG 5.2 RPG 5.5 APG 1.8 SPG 1.5 BPG

Regular Season
Dwyane Wade - 27.2 PPG .495 FG 5.7 RPG 6.7 APG 1.9 SPG 0.8 BPG


2006 Dallas Mavericks (11th in overall DRtg, Lost in NBA Finals) vs. Miami Heat

Series Stats
Dwyane Wade (Age 24) - 34.7 PPG .468 FG 7.8 RPG 3.8 APG 2.7 SPG 1.0 BPG
Dirk Nowitzki (Age 27) - 22.8 PPG .390 FG 10.8 RPG 2.5 APG 0.7 SPG 0.7 BPG
(Using age to indicate that both were in their relative primes)

Regular Season
Dwyane Wade - 27.2 PPG .495 FG 5.7 RPG 6.7 APG 1.9 SPG 0.8 BPG
Dirk Nowitzki - 26.6 PPG .480 FG 9.0 RPG 2.8 APG 0.7 SPG 1.0 BPG


So Wade, when they were both in their relative primes going head-to-head in the NBA Finals:
Had only 3 less RPG than Dirk Nowitzki. Yet, he scored nearly 12 more PPG, shot nearly 8 percentage points higher from the field, dished out more APG (expected), and even blocked more shots per game.

Did you really just cherry pick 4 playoff series?

Seriously? You asked for the numbers to the playoff series against the Pistons and Celtics that I mentioned before, I provide them, and then you scoff?

[AbeVigodaLive]

An argument could be made that's the Mavs result that season was worse in the greater scheme of things.

Miami lost 67 games in a rebuilding year where their 2nd best player player was Ricky Davis. The old players showed their age and broke down after winning the championship, Shaq was hurt and decided he didn't want to be there anymore, Wade was hurt and played 51 games. Every team goes through down years and once it was clear that team was done they pulled the plug.

Dirk just had an MVP season, his team was the number 1 seed and everyone thought it was finally their year to win it all. They got destroyed by the 8th seed in the first round.

Both are pretty bad.

Yeah. Every team does. But even when Nowitzki is hurt... and the Mavs are down... he still wills them to at least a .500 record. Wade as THE guy couldn't get his team to win even 20% of the time.

Has Dirk ever played with a guy like Michael Beasley or Ricky Davis as his 2nd best player?

Dirk won 26 more games than Wade (nearly 3x as many) ... while playing injured and missing 29 games... with OJ Mayo as his 2nd best teammate.

[AbeVigodaLive]

2010 Boston Celtics (5th in overall DRtg, Lost NBA Finals in 7) vs. Miami Heat 1st Rd
This was the year right before LeBron joined the Heat, supposedly in large part because he felt that he could not get past the Celtics on his own with the Cavs.

Series Stats
Dwyane Wade - 33.2 PPG .564 FG 5.6 RPG 6.8 APG 1.6 SPG 1.6 BPG

Regular Season
Dwyane Wade - 26.6 PPG .476 FG 4.8 RPG 6.5 APG 1.8 SPG 1.1 BPG


2005 Detroit Pistons (3rd in overall DRtg, Lost NBA Finals in 7) vs. Miami Heat ECF

Series Stats
Dwyane Wade - 25.8 PPG .440 FG 4.5 RPG 4.3 APG 1.7 SPG 1.0 BPG
*(With the Heat up 3-1, Wade sustained an injury in Game 5 and had to miss Game 6 at Detroit. He wasn't the same afterwards. Detroit ended up winning the series in 7.)

Regular Season
Dwyane Wade - 24.1 PPG .478 FG 5.2 RPG 6.8 APG 1.6 SPG 1.1 BPG


2006 Detroit Pistons (5th in overall DRtg, Lost in ECF to MIA) vs. Miami Heat ECF

Series Stats
Dwyane Wade - 26.7 PPG .617 FG 5.2 RPG 5.5 APG 1.8 SPG 1.5 BPG

Regular Season
Dwyane Wade - 27.2 PPG .495 FG 5.7 RPG 6.7 APG 1.9 SPG 0.8 BPG


2006 Dallas Mavericks (11th in overall DRtg, Lost in NBA Finals) vs. Miami Heat

Series Stats
Dwyane Wade (Age 24) - 34.7 PPG .468 FG 7.8 RPG 3.8 APG 2.7 SPG 1.0 BPG
Dirk Nowitzki (Age 27) - 22.8 PPG .390 FG 10.8 RPG 2.5 APG 0.7 SPG 0.7 BPG
(Using age to indicate that both were in their relative primes)

Regular Season
Dwyane Wade - 27.2 PPG .495 FG 5.7 RPG 6.7 APG 1.9 SPG 0.8 BPG
Dirk Nowitzki - 26.6 PPG .480 FG 9.0 RPG 2.8 APG 0.7 SPG 1.0 BPG


So Wade, when they were both in their relative primes going head-to-head in the NBA Finals:
Had only 3 less RPG than Dirk Nowitzki. Yet, he scored nearly 12 more PPG, shot nearly 8 percentage points higher from the field, dished out more APG (expected), and even blocked more shots per game.

Did you really just cherry pick 4 playoff series?

Seriously? You asked for the numbers to the playoff series against the Pistons and Celtics that I mentioned before, I provide them, and then you scoff?

Haha. My bad. I get the context now. Thanks for posting those. And for adding in the 2006 stuff. Nice job.

[vcsgrizzfan]

So losing 67 games and missing the playoffs is as bad as winning 67 and then losing in the 1st round?

An argument could be made that's the Mavs result that season was worse in the greater scheme of things.

Miami lost 67 games in a rebuilding year where their 2nd best player player was Ricky Davis. The old players showed their age and broke down after winning the championship, Shaq was hurt and decided he didn't want to be there anymore, Wade was hurt and played 51 games. Every team goes through down years and once it was clear that team was done they pulled the plug.

Dirk just had an MVP season, his team was the number 1 seed and everyone thought it was finally their year to win it all. They got destroyed by the 8th seed in the first round.

Both are pretty bad.

Agreed. And I'd say Dirk and his team's failure was much more embarrassing when you consider all of the things you mentioned.

Losing in the first round after the 67 win season is not exactly a highlight for Dirk, but let's try to remember how that series went. Maybe Dirk wasn't great, but a lot was that GSW caught lightning in a bottle. Baron Davis and others went bananas and played a few standard deviations from their norm. He couldn't miss with some real long bombs much of that series. It's a make or miss league and GSW got hot for long enough to pull off the upset. Shit happens.

[Yuh]

Yeah. Every team does. But even when Nowitzki is hurt... and the Mavs are down... he still wills them to at least a .500 record. Wade as THE guy couldn't get his team to win even 20% of the time.

Has Dirk ever played with a guy like Michael Beasley or Ricky Davis as his 2nd best player?

Dirk won 26 more games than Wade (nearly 3x as many) ... while playing injured and missing 29 games... with OJ Mayo as his 2nd best teammate.

So the answer is no then, right?

Unless you're saying that OJ Mayo is/was as bad as Michael Beasley or Ricky Davis.

[AbeVigodaLive]

Has Dirk ever played with a guy like Michael Beasley or Ricky Davis as his 2nd best player?

Dirk won 26 more games than Wade (nearly 3x as many) ... while playing injured and missing 29 games... with OJ Mayo as his 2nd best teammate.

So the answer is no then, right?

Unless you're saying that OJ Mayo is/was as bad as Michael Beasley or Ricky Davis.

OJ Mayo is worse than Ricky Davis.
Although that was Mayo's best season as a pro... 15/4/5.

Davis was a 20/5/5 type of guy at one point...

[Yuh]

Dirk won 26 more games than Wade (nearly 3x as many) ... while playing injured and missing 29 games... with OJ Mayo as his 2nd best teammate.

So the answer is no then, right?

Unless you're saying that OJ Mayo is/was as bad as Michael Beasley or Ricky Davis.

OJ Mayo is worse than Ricky Davis.
Although that was Mayo's best season as a pro... 15/4/5.

Davis was a 20/5/5 type of guy at one point...

Ricky Davis was a cancer to every team he ever played on. This was a known fact around the league. He was the personification of an "empty stats" guy who would sabotage the prospects of the team in order to "get his." He was never a team player, and never any good for anything other than empty numbers. I would never put Davis over Mayo, but I guess that's a subjective matter. In either case, I'd say that Nowitzki consistently played with greater talent around him than Wade did (save for the past 4 years).

[ripper76]

Wade has 4 votes here, not 3.

[Yuh]

Honestly, the only thing I could see Nowitzki having an advantage on Wade is the 1 MVP and having a more prolonged prime. Even so, Wade has been consistently good for many years, too. The knock on Wade is that he was only "great" for 7 or so years. However, when both are at their peaks I take Wade every time.

[Yuh]

I am a little bit puzzled with the overwhelming love for Thomas. I can see a case for him but I would have him a little lower down.

There have been a number of posts forgetting that it wasn't Thomas against the Celtics, Bulls etc and personalizing matchups. Those Pistons were deep and talented with big and versatile front courts and another HOFer in the back court with him in Dumars.

I prefer both Wade and Dirk here over Thomas.

I'll vote Wade since it appears he has the best chance to overtake Thomas at this point.

Looking at it objectively, I don't think there is a good reason. But the reasoning for it probably goes back to that old Thomas vs. Wade poll on ESPN. Since this is apparently Wade's turn to get picked, the first name that pops into people's heads is Isiah Thomas. There's still a lot of residual hate for Dwyane Wade in part because of the past 4 years. It is what it is.

[ripper76]

I am a little bit puzzled with the overwhelming love for Thomas. I can see a case for him but I would have him a little lower down.

There have been a number of posts forgetting that it wasn't Thomas against the Celtics, Bulls etc and personalizing matchups. Those Pistons were deep and talented with big and versatile front courts and another HOFer in the back court with him in Dumars.

I prefer both Wade and Dirk here over Thomas.

I'll vote Wade since it appears he has the best chance to overtake Thomas at this point.

Looking at it objectively, I don't think there is a good reason. But the reasoning for it probably goes back to that old Thomas vs. Wade poll on ESPN. Since this is apparently Wade's turn to get picked, the first name that pops into people's heads is Isiah Thomas. There's still a lot of residual hate for Dwyane Wade in part because of the past 4 years. It is what it is.

Wade, and the Heat, have gotten a lot of hate since 2006. That influences people for sure.

[elmouse03]

I am a little bit puzzled with the overwhelming love for Thomas. I can see a case for him but I would have him a little lower down.

There have been a number of posts forgetting that it wasn't Thomas against the Celtics, Bulls etc and personalizing matchups. Those Pistons were deep and talented with big and versatile front courts and another HOFer in the back court with him in Dumars.

I prefer both Wade and Dirk here over Thomas.

I'll vote Wade since it appears he has the best chance to overtake Thomas at this point.

Looking at it objectively, I don't think there is a good reason. But the reasoning for it probably goes back to that old Thomas vs. Wade poll on ESPN. Since this is apparently Wade's turn to get picked, the first name that pops into people's heads is Isiah Thomas. There's still a lot of residual hate for Dwyane Wade in part because of the past 4 years. It is what it is.

So the people who are picking Isiah Thomas is in spite of Wade?