2014 Anger General Greatest of All Time: #7 selection

[Y2K]

You make it so hard to disagree with you. i just think Duncan was the better overall player and his sustained greatness and willingness to adapt his game late in his career make him better. Also he has more regular season mvp's and fmvp's while having the same number of titles.

Duncan has never missed the playoffs and his teams never won less then 50 games in a season. Only knock on him is not being able to win back to back titles in which Kobe has done as well as 3 peated.

I appreciate that he never missed the playoffs, that really is awesome, but I did credit that being one of his advantages over Kobe (better regular season success) and that has to be partially attributed to pops greatness. When it comes down to it though, all those 50 win seasons mean about as much as Kobe's 81 point game, cool stats but if it didn't amount to anything who cares? Duncan has more Mvps and regular season success while Kobe boasts better longevity and a better h2h in the playoffs. There is no wrong pick here (unless someone picks shaq) but my laker fandom requires me to pick kobe

Shaq has a strong case. On my list, he's after Kobe and Duncan though.

[elmouse03]

Duncan has never missed the playoffs and his teams never won less then 50 games in a season. Only knock on him is not being able to win back to back titles in which Kobe has done as well as 3 peated.

I appreciate that he never missed the playoffs, that really is awesome, but I did credit that being one of his advantages over Kobe (better regular season success) and that has to be partially attributed to pops greatness. When it comes down to it though, all those 50 win seasons mean about as much as Kobe's 81 point game, cool stats but if it didn't amount to anything who cares? Duncan has more Mvps and regular season success while Kobe boasts better longevity and a better h2h in the playoffs. There is no wrong pick here (unless someone picks shaq) but my laker fandom requires me to pick kobe

Shaq has a strong case. On my list, he's after Kobe and Duncan though.

I picked Shaq because his dominance was just so dominant. I was impressed by it more then I was Kobe and Duncan.

[wailuaFC]

Duncan has never missed the playoffs and his teams never won less then 50 games in a season. Only knock on him is not being able to win back to back titles in which Kobe has done as well as 3 peated.

I appreciate that he never missed the playoffs, that really is awesome, but I did credit that being one of his advantages over Kobe (better regular season success) and that has to be partially attributed to pops greatness. When it comes down to it though, all those 50 win seasons mean about as much as Kobe's 81 point game, cool stats but if it didn't amount to anything who cares? Duncan has more Mvps and regular season success while Kobe boasts better longevity and a better h2h in the playoffs. There is no wrong pick here (unless someone picks shaq) but my laker fandom requires me to pick kobe

You don't think Shaq has a case for this spot?

I think shaq is just a step below Kobe and Duncan all time. It's funny that everyone tried to hold lebrons team jumping against him and completely overlook that aspect with shaq despite shaq playing with way more teams that were arguably just as stacked (magic to the lakers to the heat to the suns to the cavs to boston, shaq has played with more talent then any other player)

[Shill Jackson]

For the last four years Duncan has averaged a whopping 15 points, while playing 5 feet from the basket
He's basically Boozer.

[LNS]

I disagree. I think Duncan has distanced himself from those other two and an opposite view is more likely agenda driven or biased, and I think you are a classic example.

Right. Timmy's not your favorite player or anything.

And Kobe is yours.

I'm pretty damn certain I'm more objective on this than you are and I'm virtually certain a very large majority of hoops fan who have no dog in the fight would choose Duncan.

Of course Kobe is. But I wasn't accusing other posters of being biased, you were. I just found it a bit funny that you called someone out for having an agenda or being biased or whatever, and we all know you love Timmy.

It's fine either way, I didn't expect Kobe to get the nod over Duncan. I don't think it's a runaway victory for either player, a strong case can be made for both, IMO.

[elmouse03]

For the last four years Duncan has averaged a whopping 15 points, while playing 5 feet from the basket
He's basically Boozer.

WHOA!!!

I think that's worth a suspension.

[Shill Jackson]

Duncan has never missed the playoffs and his teams never won less then 50 games in a season. Only knock on him is not being able to win back to back titles in which Kobe has done as well as 3 peated.

I appreciate that he never missed the playoffs, that really is awesome, but I did credit that being one of his advantages over Kobe (better regular season success) and that has to be partially attributed to pops greatness. When it comes down to it though, all those 50 win seasons mean about as much as Kobe's 81 point game, cool stats but if it didn't amount to anything who cares? Duncan has more Mvps and regular season success while Kobe boasts better longevity and a better h2h in the playoffs. There is no wrong pick here (unless someone picks shaq) but my laker fandom requires me to pick kobe

Shaq has a strong case. On my list, he's after Kobe and Duncan though.

He doesn't have a strong case.
You rate him on potential. Facts are, he always took half seasons off. He was always lazy.

[Y2K]

You make it so hard to disagree with you. i just think Duncan was the better overall player and his sustained greatness and willingness to adapt his game late in his career make him better. Also he has more regular season mvp's and fmvp's while having the same number of titles.

Duncan has never missed the playoffs and his teams never won less then 50 games in a season. Only knock on him is not being able to win back to back titles in which Kobe has done as well as 3 peated.

POP is an all time great coach but to me the reason the Spurs have sustained success through all these years is Duncan.

That's a partially false statement. Pop and R.C. Buford have done wonderful jobs with roster replenishment And scouting. It was Pop who set the current standards for how the spurs organization will operate, and he started that in 1994 as GM.

Duncan Buying Into the system and setting the standard for the players after D-Rob was too old is, IMHO, why so many of the players took less money to stay there.

[876Stephen]

Also Kobe played with Phil Jackson for all his titles just like Duncan with Pop and most people think Phil is a greater coach than Pop.

Another thing to keep in mind. Duncan has been sacrificing personal glory for winning his whole career. If Duncan wanted to just focus on scoring as much as possible he could have done that easily. 30-40 points was nothing for Duncan in his prime he just didn't do it very often because he sacrificed for the good of the team. Thing is, Duncan has never had a team good enough were all he has to do is score and that's it.

Kobe has never had to and never wanted to make sacrifices. If his team wins it's because of him and him only. That is what contributed to the 04 finals collapse and Shaq leaving as well as Kobe not having that sustained success like Duncan.

[876Stephen]

I appreciate that he never missed the playoffs, that really is awesome, but I did credit that being one of his advantages over Kobe (better regular season success) and that has to be partially attributed to pops greatness. When it comes down to it though, all those 50 win seasons mean about as much as Kobe's 81 point game, cool stats but if it didn't amount to anything who cares? Duncan has more Mvps and regular season success while Kobe boasts better longevity and a better h2h in the playoffs. There is no wrong pick here (unless someone picks shaq) but my laker fandom requires me to pick kobe

Shaq has a strong case. On my list, he's after Kobe and Duncan though.

He doesn't have a strong case.
You rate him on potential. Facts are, he always took half seasons off. He was always lazy.

4 titles, 3 fmvp's, 1 mvp and dominating stats in the regular and postseason. That to me puts him in the top 10 and ahead of Kobe. If Shaq put in effort like you said, he might be the considered the GOAT. You lack of respect for Shaq is appalling since you claim to be a Lakers fan.

[876Stephen]

I appreciate that he never missed the playoffs, that really is awesome, but I did credit that being one of his advantages over Kobe (better regular season success) and that has to be partially attributed to pops greatness. When it comes down to it though, all those 50 win seasons mean about as much as Kobe's 81 point game, cool stats but if it didn't amount to anything who cares? Duncan has more Mvps and regular season success while Kobe boasts better longevity and a better h2h in the playoffs. There is no wrong pick here (unless someone picks shaq) but my laker fandom requires me to pick kobe

Shaq has a strong case. On my list, he's after Kobe and Duncan though.

He doesn't have a strong case.
You rate him on potential. Facts are, he always took half seasons off. He was always lazy.

4 titles, 3 fmvp's, 1 mvp and dominating stats in the regular and postseason. That to me puts him in the top 10 and ahead of Kobe. If Shaq put in effort like you said, he might be the considered the GOAT. You lack of respect for Shaq is appalling since you claim to be a Lakers fan.

[Y2K]

I appreciate that he never missed the playoffs, that really is awesome, but I did credit that being one of his advantages over Kobe (better regular season success) and that has to be partially attributed to pops greatness. When it comes down to it though, all those 50 win seasons mean about as much as Kobe's 81 point game, cool stats but if it didn't amount to anything who cares? Duncan has more Mvps and regular season success while Kobe boasts better longevity and a better h2h in the playoffs. There is no wrong pick here (unless someone picks shaq) but my laker fandom requires me to pick kobe

Shaq has a strong case. On my list, he's after Kobe and Duncan though.

He doesn't have a strong case.
You rate him on potential. Facts are, he always took half seasons off. He was always lazy.

Doesn't matter how lazy he was. He produced when he needed to:

13 straight years of 20 and 10
2 scoring titles
4 rings
4 total MVPS
3 defensive teams
Absolute monster peak

That speaks a lot.

[Y2K]

Shaq has a strong case. On my list, he's after Kobe and Duncan though.

He doesn't have a strong case.
You rate him on potential. Facts are, he always took half seasons off. He was always lazy.

4 titles, 3 fmvp's, 1 mvp and dominating stats in the regular and postseason. That to me puts him in the top 10 and ahead of Kobe. If Shaq put in effort like you said, he might be the considered the GOAT. You lack of respect for Shaq is appalling since you claim to be a Lakers fan.

[wailuaFC]

Also Kobe played with Phil Jackson for all his titles just like Duncan with Pop and most people think Phil is a greater coach than Pop.

Another thing to keep in mind. Duncan has been sacrificing personal glory for winning his whole career. If Duncan wanted to just focus on scoring as much as possible he could have done that easily. 30-40 points was nothing for Duncan in his prime he just didn't do it very often because he sacrificed for the good of the team. Thing is, Duncan has never had a team good enough were all he has to do is score and that's it.

Kobe has never had to and never wanted to make sacrifices. If his team wins it's because of him and him only. That is what contributed to the 04 finals collapse and Shaq leaving as well as Kobe not having that sustained success like Duncan.

And to be honest, that's one of the reasons I have Kobe ahead of Duncan. Duncan might be able to have better stats, but he doesn't. He has sacrificed his personal success for that of his teams, and that's made the spurs a great dynasty, but because of the back seat roll he accepted he personally has not been as impressive or dominant as Kobe as their careers progressed. The spurs have been a greater franchise then the lakers in the Kobe/Duncan eras, but Kobe has outshined Duncan because of Duncan's selflessness

[876Stephen]

Also Kobe played with Phil Jackson for all his titles just like Duncan with Pop and most people think Phil is a greater coach than Pop.

Another thing to keep in mind. Duncan has been sacrificing personal glory for winning his whole career. If Duncan wanted to just focus on scoring as much as possible he could have done that easily. 30-40 points was nothing for Duncan in his prime he just didn't do it very often because he sacrificed for the good of the team. Thing is, Duncan has never had a team good enough were all he has to do is score and that's it.

Kobe has never had to and never wanted to make sacrifices. If his team wins it's because of him and him only. That is what contributed to the 04 finals collapse and Shaq leaving as well as Kobe not having that sustained success like Duncan.

And to be honest, that's one of the reasons I have Kobe ahead of Duncan. Duncan might be able to have better stats, but he doesn't. He has sacrificed his personal success for that of his teams, and that's made the spurs a great dynasty, but because of the back seat roll he accepted he personally has not been as impressive or dominant as Kobe as their careers progressed. The spurs have been a greater franchise then the lakers in the Kobe/Duncan eras, but Kobe has outshined Duncan because of Duncan's selflessness

Did my argument just backfire right in my face?

[wailuaFC]

Also Kobe played with Phil Jackson for all his titles just like Duncan with Pop and most people think Phil is a greater coach than Pop.

Another thing to keep in mind. Duncan has been sacrificing personal glory for winning his whole career. If Duncan wanted to just focus on scoring as much as possible he could have done that easily. 30-40 points was nothing for Duncan in his prime he just didn't do it very often because he sacrificed for the good of the team. Thing is, Duncan has never had a team good enough were all he has to do is score and that's it.

Kobe has never had to and never wanted to make sacrifices. If his team wins it's because of him and him only. That is what contributed to the 04 finals collapse and Shaq leaving as well as Kobe not having that sustained success like Duncan.

And to be honest, that's one of the reasons I have Kobe ahead of Duncan. Duncan might be able to have better stats, but he doesn't. He has sacrificed his personal success for that of his teams, and that's made the spurs a great dynasty, but because of the back seat roll he accepted he personally has not been as impressive or dominant as Kobe as their careers progressed. The spurs have been a greater franchise then the lakers in the Kobe/Duncan eras, but Kobe has outshined Duncan because of Duncan's selflessness

Did my argument just backfire right in my face?

Haha not at all, team accomplishments are very important when ranking players as evident by wilts slip to 5, I'm just trying to spin things to justify my homerism

[Da Stars.]

Also Kobe played with Phil Jackson for all his titles just like Duncan with Pop and most people think Phil is a greater coach than Pop.

Another thing to keep in mind. Duncan has been sacrificing personal glory for winning his whole career. If Duncan wanted to just focus on scoring as much as possible he could have done that easily. 30-40 points was nothing for Duncan in his prime he just didn't do it very often because he sacrificed for the good of the team. Thing is, Duncan has never had a team good enough were all he has to do is score and that's it.

Kobe has never had to and never wanted to make sacrifices. If his team wins it's because of him and him only. That is what contributed to the 04 finals collapse and Shaq leaving as well as Kobe not having that sustained success like Duncan.

And to be honest, that's one of the reasons I have Kobe ahead of Duncan. Duncan might be able to have better stats, but he doesn't. He has sacrificed his personal success for that of his teams, and that's made the spurs a great dynasty, but because of the back seat roll he accepted he personally has not been as impressive or dominant as Kobe as their careers progressed. The spurs have been a greater franchise then the lakers in the Kobe/Duncan eras, but Kobe has outshined Duncan because of Duncan's selflessness

Did my argument just backfire right in my face?

No it did not.

[876Stephen]

And to be honest, that's one of the reasons I have Kobe ahead of Duncan. Duncan might be able to have better stats, but he doesn't. He has sacrificed his personal success for that of his teams, and that's made the spurs a great dynasty, but because of the back seat roll he accepted he personally has not been as impressive or dominant as Kobe as their careers progressed. The spurs have been a greater franchise then the lakers in the Kobe/Duncan eras, but Kobe has outshined Duncan because of Duncan's selflessness

Did my argument just backfire right in my face?

Haha not at all, team accomplishments are very important when ranking players as evident by wilts slip to 5, I'm just trying to spin things to justify my homerism

[Y2K]

Did my argument just backfire right in my face?

Haha not at all, team accomplishments are very important when ranking players as evident by wilts slip to 5, I'm just trying to spin things to justify my homerism

Seriously, it's a double-edged sword. Sometimes, u gotta wonder just how far the Spurs could have gone had Duncan not been so selfless in younger years that he was capable of producing better stats. But that's the system that they have in san antonio. Pop won't stand for anything but selflessness.

[Shill Jackson]

Shaq has a strong case. On my list, he's after Kobe and Duncan though.

He doesn't have a strong case.
You rate him on potential. Facts are, he always took half seasons off. He was always lazy.

Doesn't matter how lazy he was. He produced when he needed to:

13 straight years of 20 and 10
2 scoring titles
4 rings
4 total MVPS
3 defensive teams
Absolute monster peak

That speaks a lot.

Of course it matters.
Name another 'superstar' cloaked with "lazy"