Most impressive MJ accomplishment ever...???

[Titan18]

Bill Cucksell played a team with a losing record in his first finals. Such a concentration of elite talent



Oh yea, Celtics improved by 5 wins in Russell’s first year. Thanks for bringing up that Jordan improved the Bulls by 11. So Jordan roughly had a 2.2X greater impact joining the Bulls than Russell did joining the Celtics

Glad that settles it

[Bush4Ever.]

Sooo... no analysis of the supporting casts of all those players, eh bush-league?

The fact Jordan barely raised his team's win totals completely contradicts the "but but but teammates" narrative.

If you have terrible teammates, it's EASIER to raise a team's win totals.

Yet Jordan:

-Only increased by 11 Y0 to Y1
-Only increased by 2 Y2 to Y3

-Saw his team only drop by two games 1993 to 1994 when he was removed.

For Bird:

-Increased by 32 Y0 to Y1
-Win a ring in Y2

-Saw his team drop 15 games from 1988 to 1989 when he was removed (wait...I thought he had title-quality teammates?)
-Saw his team raise 10 games from 1989 to 1990 when he was added back.

lol lol lol

[Bush4Ever.]

autism and innumeracy

Learn statistics and read carefully.

Russell joined a "respectable" team. It's harder to improve win totals by X amount if you are higher up the scale than if you are lower.

Statistics 101.

By the way, they dropped 7x (14 vs 2) games the first season after removing Russell compared to Jordan.

[Robceltsfan]

Bill Cucksell played a team with a losing record in his first finals. Such a concentration of elite talent



Oh yea, Celtics improved by 5 wins in Russell’s first year. Thanks for bringing up that Jordan improved the Bulls by 11. So Jordan roughly had a 2.2X greater impact joining the Bulls than Russell did joining the Celtics

Glad that settles it

Russell only appeared in 48 of 72 games as a rookie.

The only important numbers are from the playoffs....where the Celtics record went from 1-2 (first round bounce) to 7-3 (NBA champs).

[Titan18]

autism and innumeracy

Learn statistics and read carefully.

Russell joined a "respectable" team. It's harder to improve win totals by X amount if you are higher up the scale than if you are lower.

Statistics 101.

By the way, they dropped 7x (14 vs 2) games the first season after removing Russell compared to Jordan.

So we agree that 11>5

Thanks for that

[Bush4Ever.]

So we agree that 11>5

Thanks for that

"Creatine only increased this professional strongman's lift by 0.25 percent! But I gave a generic protein shake to this new lifter and his lifts increased by 25 percent in a year! Generic protein shakes have 100 times the effect of creatine!"

-Literally Titan

[Titan18]

Oh and while on topic of year after removal

Bulls 1 - 2 games
Bulls 2 - 49 games
Wizards - 12 games

Average drop of 21 games

So I’m no mathematician but I’m pretty sure 11>5 and 21>14

Glad it’s settled per your criteria

[Shill Jackson]

Can we agree that Russell was not on PEDs while Jordan most definitely was?

[Bush4Ever.]

Oh and while on topic of year after removal

Bulls 1 - 2 games
Bulls 2 - 49 games

Dumb. First of all it would 41 games normed to a regular 82 game season.

1999 saw the removal of both Jordan and Pippen.

Since we know what Jordan's solo drop equaled to (2 games), and know what Jordan + Pippen's drop equaled to (41 games), it stands to reason Pippen was responsible for 39/41 of the effect (95 percent).

Which proves my point about Pippen being more important than Jordan.

You are literally proving me right with your own arguments.

[elmouse03]

Bill Cucksell played a team with a losing record in his first finals. Such a concentration of elite talent



Oh yea, Celtics improved by 5 wins in Russell’s first year. Thanks for bringing up that Jordan improved the Bulls by 11. So Jordan roughly had a 2.2X greater impact joining the Bulls than Russell did joining the Celtics

Glad that settles it

Russell only appeared in 48 of 72 games as a rookie.

The only important numbers are from the playoffs....where the Celtics record went from 1-2 (first round bounce) to 7-3 (NBA champs).

If only Pettit made that shot.

[Titan18]

Oh and while on topic of year after removal

Bulls 1 - 2 games
Bulls 2 - 49 games

Dumb. First of all it would 41 games normed to a regular 82 game season.

Oh yea, then it would be an average of 18 game drop.

So it’s

11>5
18>14

Thanks for clarifying!

[thedangerouskitchen]

Russell actually beat two (2) teams in the Finals with LOSING records (1957 and 1959), and in 1958 he lost in the Finals to a LOWER seed. In the 62, 63, and 65 Finals Russ beat a Lakers teams with just two (2) HOFERS, while Boston featured 7, 8, and 5 HOFERS on their rosters, respectively. In 1964 Russ beat the 3 HOFER Warriors while his Celts featured 7 HOFERS.

I could go on and on... but we all know what's what: Russ' Celtics were STACKED relative to his competition... faaaaar more talented than their opposition, and that's a fact whether bush-league likes it or not.

[AlaskaHawks]

Wow looks like Pippen was more valuable than Jordan?

[Bush4Ever.]

Wow looks like Pippen was more valuable than Jordan?

Pippen had a big task in front of him to better Jordan's pre-Pippen playoff winning rate (basically, one game win every three years)

Herculean task...but he did it.

[Titan18]

Stop being a fag bush

Happy Friday!

[Bush4Ever.]

Stop being a fag bush

Happy Friday!

Hey man, words can hurt.

You have a good Friday too.

[vcsgrizzfan]

Russell actually beat two (2) teams in the Finals with LOSING records (1957 and 1959), and in 1958 he lost in the Finals to a LOWER seed. In the 62, 63, and 65 Finals Russ beat a Lakers teams with just two (2) HOFERS, while Boston featured 7, 8, and 5 HOFERS on their rosters, respectively. In 1964 Russ beat the 3 HOFER Warriors while his Celts featured 7 HOFERS.

I could go on and on... but we all know what's what: Russ' Celtics were STACKED relative to his competition... faaaaar more talented than their opposition, and that's a fact whether bush-league likes it or not.

He also had a knee injury that finals. He missed a game that they lost, and was largely ineffectual compared to his usual self. It's the same team he had beaten the prior year in the finals. No injury, and it's almost certainly 12 out of 13. Try again.

[thedangerouskitchen]

Wow looks like Pippen was more valuable than Jordan?

That would make Pippen the GOAT, and clearly better than LeCommie.

I'm okay with that.

[Robceltsfan]

Wow looks like Pippen was more valuable than Jordan?

That would make Pippen the GOAT, and clearly better than LeCommie.

I'm okay with that.

No….it just means that Jordan had the second best player in the NBA on his team for most of his career.

#easystreet

[thedangerouskitchen]

Russell actually beat two (2) teams in the Finals with LOSING records (1957 and 1959), and in 1958 he lost in the Finals to a LOWER seed. In the 62, 63, and 65 Finals Russ beat a Lakers teams with just two (2) HOFERS, while Boston featured 7, 8, and 5 HOFERS on their rosters, respectively. In 1964 Russ beat the 3 HOFER Warriors while his Celts featured 7 HOFERS.

I could go on and on... but we all know what's what: Russ' Celtics were STACKED relative to his competition... faaaaar more talented than their opposition, and that's a fact whether bush-league likes it or not.

He also had a knee injury that finals. He missed a game that they lost, and was largely ineffectual compared to his usual self. It's the same team he had beaten the prior year in the finals. No injury, and it's almost certainly 12 out of 13. Try again.

BHAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA... all of a sudden injuries are an excuse?????





How about those sub .500 teams he beat in the Finals????



That said, no one is taking anything away from the Celtics' Dynasty... the point here is that it just wasn't as impressive as the Bulls' Dynasty is all, for the boatload of reasons provided ITT.

That is all.