Does demon possession exist?

[vcsgrizzfan]

This thread is severely missing Clevetown.

You should pipe in here Carl. I don't want to be rude, but I t hought your religion believed that you potentially have the opportunity to have your own world to rule in the future?

Not sure I have much to add. I already stated that anybody that calls themselves a Christian should say they believe demon possessions exist. There are several accounts in the Bible of it happening.

We do believe in eternal progression if that's what you're referring to. The own world thing has been twisted so much it's almost funny to see people still bring it up. We definitely don't believe that you die and go to heaven or hell and either suffer for eternity or praise God for eternity. I'd be happy to go into more but probably through pms if people are interested.

I am not Christian and believe demonic possession is nonsense, but that is neither here nor there.

I am interested in "eternal progression" though as I don't know anything about that at all about that concept but I'd like to understand your religion a little better. Maybe you could PM a quick explanation and maybe a link to something that explains it fairly simplistically. I also didn't appreciate that Mormoms didn't believe in the concept of Heaven and Hell. Thanks for that.

[Shill Jackson]

rob obliterating Bush ITT.

Rob hates God because God doesn't want him to jack off to midget porn, and isn't thrilled with the behaviors leading to his BMI. For his part, God doesn't even stop Rob from doing those things under free will.

There is a meaningful chance any aliens that could come to Earth would make even the old testament God look like a complete pushover.

Rob very well might be stanning for beings that would see him as we see worms or bugs.

I know you are trolling, but you answered my troll, so I'll answer yours.

Rob doesn't hate God. He simply doesn't believe he exists. I don't think he necessarily believes in aliens visiting earth (he can answer that), but he believes advanced aliens are more likely to exist and have been here than God. That is certainly tenable.

I don't believe aliens have been here because I think the technological problems to make traveling that distance are insurmountable, but I know I am on shaky ground on that one because of my limited ability to understand how much further advanced other worlds might be. I definitely believe there are other intelligent beings (however you want to define that) in the universes out there because the odds that in the trillions of galaxies out there that we are "all by our lonesome" is preposterous to me.

*if you’ll indulge me in a small edit.
Technological problems that make it insurmountable, based on our very limited knowledge.

We still do not know what gravity "is" in any fundamental way - we only know how it behaves.
Flight was always considered impossible, until it wasn’t. Once flight was achieved, we reached the moon in less than a century.
I believe we will come to great leaps in space travel soon enough.
Mastering fusion will be a big step.

and yes, other beings certainly exist, based on the odds alone.
A god’s existence is highly unlikely.
It’s even more unlikely that your choice of god is the correct one.

[Uncontroversial]

I know you are trolling, but you answered my troll, so I'll answer yours.

Rob doesn't hate God. He simply doesn't believe he exists. I don't think he necessarily believes in aliens visiting earth (he can answer that), but he believes advanced aliens are more likely to exist and have been here than God. That is certainly tenable.

I don't believe aliens have been here because I think the technological problems to make traveling that distance are insurmountable, but I know I am on shaky ground on that one because of my limited ability to understand how much further advanced other worlds might be. I definitely believe there are other intelligent beings (however you want to define that) in the universes out there because the odds that in the trillions of galaxies out there that we are "all by our lonesome" is preposterous to me.

I'm being light-hearted but not trolling.

Rob actively hates God, or the concept of God.

He's a rabid anti-theist. Not just an atheist dispassionately attempt to find his way to truth.

Believing God cannot exist while aliens definitely exist because of the size of the universe (as if God himself couldn't ALSO be tucked away in some pocket of the universe like these theoretical aliens are) illustrates someone is mixing in emotion and autism with their analysis, even with handfuls of rationality thrown in the mix.

Literally every single "but but but....size of the universe super big even if we don't have direct contact/evidence" objection to the rejection of aliens also would apply to God (or a God-like being in general).

moronic take

evidence for natural life on other planets is based on proof of natural life on this planet

there is no evidence of supernatural life (god) anywhere. By your "reasoning", one could say leprechauns are as likely to exists in the universe as aliens and gods.

[vcsgrizzfan]

Rob hates God because God doesn't want him to jack off to midget porn, and isn't thrilled with the behaviors leading to his BMI. For his part, God doesn't even stop Rob from doing those things under free will.

There is a meaningful chance any aliens that could come to Earth would make even the old testament God look like a complete pushover.

Rob very well might be stanning for beings that would see him as we see worms or bugs.

I know you are trolling, but you answered my troll, so I'll answer yours.

Rob doesn't hate God. He simply doesn't believe he exists. I don't think he necessarily believes in aliens visiting earth (he can answer that), but he believes advanced aliens are more likely to exist and have been here than God. That is certainly tenable.

I don't believe aliens have been here because I think the technological problems to make traveling that distance are insurmountable, but I know I am on shaky ground on that one because of my limited ability to understand how much further advanced other worlds might be. I definitely believe there are other intelligent beings (however you want to define that) in the universes out there because the odds that in the trillions of galaxies out there that we are "all by our lonesome" is preposterous to me.

*if you’ll indulge me in a small edit.
Technological problems that make it insurmountable, based on our very limited knowledge.

We still do not know what gravity "is" in any fundamental way - we only know how it behaves.
Flight was always considered impossible, until it wasn’t. Once flight was achieved, we reached the moon in less than a century.
I believe we will come to great leaps in space travel soon enough.
Mastering fusion will be a big step.

and yes, other beings certainly exist, based on the odds alone.
A god’s existence is highly unlikely.
It’s even more unlikely that your choice of god is the correct one.

I pretty much acknowedged that immediately by saying I was on shaky ground because of my limited ability to understand how much further advanced other worlds might be.

[rileymartin]

I know you are trolling, but you answered my troll, so I'll answer yours.

Rob doesn't hate God. He simply doesn't believe he exists. I don't think he necessarily believes in aliens visiting earth (he can answer that), but he believes advanced aliens are more likely to exist and have been here than God. That is certainly tenable.

I don't believe aliens have been here because I think the technological problems to make traveling that distance are insurmountable, but I know I am on shaky ground on that one because of my limited ability to understand how much further advanced other worlds might be. I definitely believe there are other intelligent beings (however you want to define that) in the universes out there because the odds that in the trillions of galaxies out there that we are "all by our lonesome" is preposterous to me.

I'm being light-hearted but not trolling.

Rob actively hates God, or the concept of God.

He's a rabid anti-theist. Not just an atheist dispassionately attempt to find his way to truth.

Believing God cannot exist while aliens definitely exist because of the size of the universe (as if God himself couldn't ALSO be tucked away in some pocket of the universe like these theoretical aliens are) illustrates someone is mixing in emotion and autism with their analysis, even with handfuls of rationality thrown in the mix.

Literally every single "but but but....size of the universe super big even if we don't have direct contact/evidence" objection to the rejection of aliens also would apply to God (or a God-like being in general).

moronic take

evidence for natural life on other planets is based on proof of natural life on this planet

there is no evidence of supernatural life (god) anywhere. By your "reasoning", one could say leprechauns are as likely to exists in the universe as aliens and gods.

The bible is full of all of these amazing miracles God did back in the day, but now that these miracles could really be documented and proven, God decided not to perform miracles anymore...Now you just have to have faith that he COULD do miracles if he wanted too...LOL...

[Bush4Ever.]

moronic take

evidence for natural life on other planets is based on proof of natural life on this planet

there is no evidence of supernatural life (god) anywhere. By your "reasoning", one could say leprechauns are as likely to exists in the universe as aliens and gods.

Not "as likely".

But > 0 percent. Not everything in the universe of events with a p of > 0 is equally likely.

Read what people write. Stop trying to be an edgy edgylord of edge.

You hate God. It's regrettable, but it's your choice.

But make no mistake about it...your position on aliens in combination with your position on God illustrates your analysis is coming from a place of emotion, not a place of science and rationality.

[vcsgrizzfan]

moronic take

evidence for natural life on other planets is based on proof of natural life on this planet

there is no evidence of supernatural life (god) anywhere. By your "reasoning", one could say leprechauns are as likely to exists in the universe as aliens and gods.

Not "as likely".

But > 0 percent. Not everything in the universe of events with a p of > 0 is equally likely.

Read what people write. Stop trying to be an edgy edgylord of edge.

You hate God. It's regrettable, but it's your choice.

But make no mistake about it...your position on aliens in combination with your position on God illustrates your analysis is coming from a place of emotion, not a place of science and rationality.

You keep saying people "hate" God. He doesn't hate God, he just doesn't believe he exists. There was a time when you believed the same thing. I don't believe in God, but if by some tiny chance he did exist, I certainly would not hate him, and I doubt Madnesssss or rob would either. I might think he has some "splaining to do" to a mere human dummy like myself, but that's a different topic.

Madnessssss' position is completely rational. There is a very tiny chance that God exists (which he has rounded down to zero, and you can quibble about that) and a very high probability that other intelligent life exists in the universe. Holding both those beliefs makes total sense.

[Bush4Ever.]

You keep saying people "hate" God. He doesn't hate God, he just doesn't believe he exists. There was a time when you believed the same thing. I don't believe in God, but if by some tiny chance he did exist, I certainly would not hate him, and I doubt Madnesssss or rob would either. I might think he has some "splaining to do" to a mere human dummy like myself, but that's a different topic.

Madnessssss' position is completely rational. There is a very tiny chance that God exists (which he has rounded down to zero, and you can quibble about that) and a very high probability that other intelligent life exists in the universe. Holding both those beliefs makes total sense.

It's a hatred of God, or if you don't believe, the hatred of the concept of God.

In general, this reduces down to disliking people (on political fronts) who happen to believe in God, thus in order to align yourself with a competing tribe, hating God to counter the loving God of the opposing tribe.

The other major factor is HATING and FOAMING AT THE MOUTH at the idea of cosmic standards and cosmic justice, when those standards run contrary to your animalistic base desires. It's basically the adult version of a child-parent relationship where the parent tells the child they can't have skittles and ice cream for dinner, and the child hating the parent.

The science on religious non-belief is extremely settled.

The nonbeliever is overwhelmingly more mentally ill than believers, and not surprisingly....it's reflected in their belief.

Interesting how atheists claim to have full knowledge of the mysteries of the universe, but can't figure out how relatively more mundane things like marriage and not dying:

[Uncontroversial]

moronic take

evidence for natural life on other planets is based on proof of natural life on this planet

there is no evidence of supernatural life (god) anywhere. By your "reasoning", one could say leprechauns are as likely to exists in the universe as aliens and gods.

Not "as likely".

But > 0 percent. Not everything in the universe of events with a p of > 0 is equally likely.

Read what people write. Stop trying to be an edgy edgylord of edge.

You hate God. It's regrettable, but it's your choice.

But make no mistake about it...your position on aliens in combination with your position on God illustrates your analysis is coming from a place of emotion, not a place of science and rationality.

We know life can exist on planets. Theres shitloads of it here.

Theres no evidence of any god despite god being the most researched hypothesis in human history

Youre a moron

[Bush4Ever.]

"I know the mysteries of the universe....I'm so very smart"

"Well...why can't you get laid then?"

That exchange settles debates with about 80 percent of Atheists.

[Uncontroversial]

You keep saying people "hate" God. He doesn't hate God, he just doesn't believe he exists. There was a time when you believed the same thing. I don't believe in God, but if by some tiny chance he did exist, I certainly would not hate him, and I doubt Madnesssss or rob would either. I might think he has some "splaining to do" to a mere human dummy like myself, but that's a different topic.

Madnessssss' position is completely rational. There is a very tiny chance that God exists (which he has rounded down to zero, and you can quibble about that) and a very high probability that other intelligent life exists in the universe. Holding both those beliefs makes total sense.

It's a hatred of God, or if you don't believe, the hatred of the concept of God.

In general, this reduces down to disliking people (on political fronts) who happen to believe in God, thus in order to align yourself with a competing tribe, hating God to counter the loving God of the opposing tribe.

The other major factor is HATING and FOAMING AT THE MOUTH at the idea of cosmic standards and cosmic justice, when those standards run contrary to your animalistic base desires. It's basically the adult version of a child-parent relationship where the parent tells the child they can't have skittles and ice cream for dinner, and the child hating the parent.

The science on religious non-belief is extremely settled.

The nonbeliever is overwhelmingly more mentally ill than believers, and not surprisingly....it's reflected in their belief.

Interesting how atheists claim to have full knowledge of the mysteries of the universe, but can't figure out how relatively more mundane things like marriage and not dying:

doubt that data point comes from a legit scientific journal. Looks more like a meme.

But youre so dumb, you dont understand that even if religion makes one happier and healthier, that does not make the religion true.

[Bush4Ever.]

doubt that data point comes from a legit scientific journal. Looks more like a meme.

Psychological Bulletin is the premier journal in the field of psychology.

You would know that if you were actually scientifically literate and not a poser.



"Okay...Lebron made 18 all-star teams...but that was in the NBA....I doubt he could do it in a legit basketball league"
-Madness

lol

[Uncontroversial]

doubt that data point comes from a legit scientific journal. Looks more like a meme.

Psychological Bulletin is the premier journal in the field of psychology.

You would know that if you were actually scientifically literate and not a poser.

youve spent your whole life in the field only to get massacred by me in this thread

[vcsgrizzfan]

You keep saying people "hate" God. He doesn't hate God, he just doesn't believe he exists. There was a time when you believed the same thing. I don't believe in God, but if by some tiny chance he did exist, I certainly would not hate him, and I doubt Madnesssss or rob would either. I might think he has some "splaining to do" to a mere human dummy like myself, but that's a different topic.

Madnessssss' position is completely rational. There is a very tiny chance that God exists (which he has rounded down to zero, and you can quibble about that) and a very high probability that other intelligent life exists in the universe. Holding both those beliefs makes total sense.

It's a hatred of God, or if you don't believe, the hatred of the concept of God.

In general, this reduces down to disliking people (on political fronts) who happen to believe in God, thus in order to align yourself with a competing tribe, hating God to counter the loving God of the opposing tribe.

The other major factor is HATING and FOAMING AT THE MOUTH at the idea of cosmic standards and cosmic justice, when those standards run contrary to your animalistic base desires. It's basically the adult version of a child-parent relationship where the parent tells the child they can't have skittles and ice cream for dinner, and the child hating the parent.

The science on religious non-belief is extremely settled.

The nonbeliever is overwhelmingly more mentally ill than believers, and not surprisingly....it's reflected in their belief.

Interesting how atheists claim to have full knowledge of the mysteries of the universe, but can't figure out how relatively more mundane things like marriage and not dying:

We definitely aren't going to get anywhere on this topic. I just plain think you are wrong. There is no inconsistency in not beileving in a God (or at least believing that the possibility of him existing is relatively trivial) and believing there is a great deal of other intelligent life in the universe.

To put it relatively simply.

I believe the likelihood of there being a God is remote. Not zero, but remote.
I believe the likelihood of there being intelligent life scattered around the universe is high.
I believe it is unlikely, but possible that there could be a God and intelligent life scattered around the universe.
I believe the possibility that there is a God and that there is no intelligent life in any other part of the universe is infinitesimally small.

[Bush4Ever.]

To be clear, I'm not saying the above makes God a fact.

I'm not really talking about that. I'm talking about the mindset of the nonbeliever and their motivations for nonbelief.

Generally, it's a) politics, b) the childlike rebellion mindset, or c) generalized hatred of life and personal living situations that bleeds into hatred of the "ultimate architect" of that reality and living situation.

[LeBronMonsterDunk]

I've said before that theists and atheists are just different sides of the same coin. You're both claiming as fact something that cannot be proven.

[vcsgrizzfan]

To be clear, I'm not saying the above makes God a fact.

I'm not really talking about that. I'm talking about the mindset of the nonbeliever and their motivations for nonbelief.

Generally, it's a) politics, b) the childlike rebellion mindset, or c) generalized hatred of life and personal living situations that bleeds into hatred of the "ultimate architect" of that reality and living situation.

I think that is incredibly judgmental. I'm sure there is a subset of atheists that would fit into what you are trying to say.

There is also a subset of people who believe in God who are absolutely batshit crazy and would kill the majority of the world that doesn't agree with their view of the world.

I am an atheist I, and I know many atheists and we got there with independent thought. You are really overthinking this.

[LeBronMonsterDunk]

"Does God(s) exist?" isn't even the question you should be asking yourself on this topic.

[Bush4Ever.]

I think that is incredibly judgmental. I'm sure there is a subset of atheists that would fit into what you are trying to say.

There is also a subset of people who believe in God who are absolutely batshit crazy and would kill the majority of the world that doesn't agree with their view of the world.

I am an atheist I, and I know many atheists and we got there with independent thought. You are really overthinking this.

Unfortunately, the science is settled on this topic.

Atheists are more likely to be virgins, unmarried, childless, possessing fewer social bonds, be unpopular and bullied, be judged as less sexually attractive, etc...

You have unquestioning belief in "science" when it leads to a conclusion that alien life a)probably exists, and b)probably won't be discovered by us in any time span except maybe the super far future.

But you suddenly lose that faith in science when it proves believers have it all over nonbelievers on the overwhelming majority of important quality-of-life metrics?

Interesting....interesting.

[Uncontroversial]

I think that is incredibly judgmental. I'm sure there is a subset of atheists that would fit into what you are trying to say.

There is also a subset of people who believe in God who are absolutely batshit crazy and would kill the majority of the world that doesn't agree with their view of the world.

I am an atheist I, and I know many atheists and we got there with independent thought. You are really overthinking this.

Unfortunately, the science is settled on this topic.

Atheists are more likely to be virgins, unmarried, childless, possessing fewer social bonds, be unpopular and bullied, be judged as less sexually attractive, etc...

You have unquestioning belief in "science" when it leads to a conclusion that alien life a)probably exists, and b)probably won't be discovered by us in any time span except maybe the super far future.

But you suddenly lose that faith in science when it proves believers have it all over nonbelievers on the overwhelming majority of important quality-of-life metrics?

Interesting....interesting.

i already exposed that broken logic. No correlation between healthy/happy and true. So now youre doing the "Rodgers is better than Brady" style obvious trolling to get out of the debate.