Bush4Ever35 wrote:As an objective observer to this debate, I have to say Griff and TDK haven't really put up the best defense.
Then again, when your lives are heavily tied to professional athletes who don't give two shits about you, you have other, more serious problems to deal with,
I used to post heavily on a Miami Heat board. In ourless heated moments we would muse about obsessing about athletes who don't even know we're alive.
Sudanese Sensation wrote:
I used to post heavily on a Miami Heat board. In ourless heated moments we would muse about obsessing about athletes who don't even know we're alive.
TDK and Griff work backwards from conclusion to evidence to form opinions.
Thankfully, neither one has a job that requires analytical skills or sobriety.
Sudanese Sensation wrote:
I used to post heavily on a Miami Heat board. In ourless heated moments we would muse about obsessing about athletes who don't even know we're alive.
TDK and Griff work backwards from conclusion to evidence to form opinions.
Thankfully, neither one has a job that requires analytical skills or sobriety.
There seems to be more going on than just deductive thinking.
Sudanese Sensation wrote:
I used to post heavily on a Miami Heat board. In ourless heated moments we would muse about obsessing about athletes who don't even know we're alive.
TDK and Griff work backwards from conclusion to evidence to form opinions.
Thankfully, neither one has a job that requires analytical skills or sobriety.
Sudanese Sensation wrote:
I used to post heavily on a Miami Heat board. In ourless heated moments we would muse about obsessing about athletes who don't even know we're alive.
TDK and Griff work backwards from conclusion to evidence to form opinions.
Thankfully, neither one has a job that requires analytical skills or sobriety.
lol right on man
*slap hands
Are you and Bush alleging that TDK and griff are intellectually challenged ?
thedangerouskitchen wrote:
I couldn't care less about "understanding" any "exercise" that has KG Top 8, Bird/Magic borderline Top 10, etc, etc, especially when the author isn't consistent with the use of his own logic/criteria.
There is nothing credible here, professor.
How is the author not consistent?
You were already provided with several examples.
"Pippen 23rd but KG Top 8... Magic/Bird borderline Top 10... Karl Malone ahead of Kobe, etc., etc... it's laughable in too many ways to count, really." - TDK
"Pippen 23rd but KG Top 8... Magic/Bird borderline Top 10... Karl Malone ahead of Kobe, etc., etc... it's laughable in too many ways to count, really." - TDK
So what's the problem according to you?
Ignoring everything else, I would love to hear an argument— even a drunken, rambling one— for Pippen over KG.
thedangerouskitchen wrote:
You were already provided with several examples.
"Pippen 23rd but KG Top 8... Magic/Bird borderline Top 10... Karl Malone ahead of Kobe, etc., etc... it's laughable in too many ways to count, really." - TDK
So what's the problem according to you?
Ignoring everything else, I would love to hear an argument— even a drunken, rambling one— for Pippen over KG.
kevin garnett is the most all around versatile 2 way long athletic playmaking, scoring, defensive do it all player in nba history
he impacts in so many different ways and can play 3-4 positions if absolutely necessary. great ball handling skills too. great longevity. unselfish. great leader... if we ignore rings/fmvps and alpha clutch abilities then hes the greatest ever by this formula youre all obsessed with
but theres only one problem... scottie pippen is the 2nd best player ever by this criteria ... so who gives a shit
everybody move the fuck on already lmao.. stop worshipping the word of a random nobody just cause you have a hard on for someone thats gonna be placed high on someones meaningless list
the best player isnt always the most all around or versatile
Greatest Individual Playoff Performance in NBA history - 22y.o = 29.4 ppg, 7.3 rpg, 6.1 apg, 15-1 Record, #1 in Win Shares
Y2K wrote:
"Pippen 23rd but KG Top 8... Magic/Bird borderline Top 10... Karl Malone ahead of Kobe, etc., etc... it's laughable in too many ways to count, really." - TDK
So what's the problem according to you?
Ignoring everything else, I would love to hear an argument— even a drunken, rambling one— for Pippen over KG.
kevin garnett is the most all around versatile 2 way long athletic playmaking, scoring, defensive do it all player in nba history
he impacts in so many different ways and can play 3-4 positions if absolutely necessary. great ball handling skills too. great longevity. unselfish. great leader... if we ignore rings/fmvps and alpha clutch abilities then hes the greatest ever by this formula youre all obsessed with
but theres only one problem... scottie pippen is the 2nd best player ever by this criteria ... so who gives a shit
everybody move the fuck on already lmao.. stop worshipping the word of a random nobody just cause you have a hard on for someone thats gonna be placed high on someones meaningless list
the best player isnt always the most all around or versatile
What happens if you put KG on those legendary Bulls teams and Pippen on those not so legendary Timberwolves teams how many championships does each have with those two teams ?
Last edited by Sudanese Sensation on Sat Mar 17, 2018 2:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
rtiff68 wrote:
Ignoring everything else, I would love to hear an argument— even a drunken, rambling one— for Pippen over KG.
kevin garnett is the most all around versatile 2 way long athletic playmaking, scoring, defensive do it all player in nba history
he impacts in so many different ways and can play 3-4 positions if absolutely necessary. great ball handling skills too. great longevity. unselfish. great leader... if we ignore rings/fmvps and alpha clutch abilities then hes the greatest ever by this formula youre all obsessed with
but theres only one problem... scottie pippen is the 2nd best player ever by this criteria ... so who gives a shit
everybody move the fuck on already lmao.. stop worshipping the word of a random nobody just cause you have a hard on for someone thats gonna be placed high on someones meaningless list
the best player isnt always the most all around or versatile
What happens if you put KG on those legendary Bulls teams and Pippen on those not so legendary Timberwolves teams how many championships does each have with those two teams ?
well garnett was a forward/center
pippens a point/small forward
wouldn't work out as well for either team just based on rotations and spacing/responsibilities
i'd guess pippen would also get nowhere in minny other than at most a WCF appearence in 2004 aswell
Rondo/Pierce/Allen/Peak pippen also probably win in 2008 and lose in 2010
so i dunno... the results are the same either way
Greatest Individual Playoff Performance in NBA history - 22y.o = 29.4 ppg, 7.3 rpg, 6.1 apg, 15-1 Record, #1 in Win Shares
I'm somebody who is pretty high on KG (higher than ElGee, the guy doing these rankings). Here is a mental exercise for you guys:
(1) List your top 30 players.
(2) For each player in your top 30, write down the player in your top 30 that best complements that star.
(3) List the players who are got the most mentions in (2).
Thought process here- the goal is to win multiple championships. If you build a contender that can achieve that goal, you're probably going to need at least 2 all-time great players. Of course you need a good supporting cast, but the better your top two guys complement one another, the less you need from your role players.
Bush4Ever35 wrote:You guys are looking for rationality where there is only emotion.
Griff hates this because the end result ranks Kobe lower than is general thought according to the "usual" methodologies.
Ditto with TDK, since this methodology is likely to bring Lebron closer (over?) Jordan, as compared to the usual methodologies.
It's just self-interest. That's all.
i don't hate it because of kobes ranking. i hate it because of everyone elses ranking
its not consistent
if you're gonna discount kobes accomplishments and base this shit on all around versatility/multiple positional skills and give no credit to winning titles... then wtf is jordan doing anywhere near the top 10
why isn't pippen top 5
i have no problem with kobe being ranked accordingly if everyone else is too and this isn't just another agenda list to knock kobe down a peg or 2
this is the exact same hypocritical shit that espn pulled with their analytics/PER all time rankings so they could drop kobe out of the top 10... only problem is bill russell was still top 5 ( even though analytics suggest hes not even top 100 ) and chris paul was nowhere near ranked where he actually is analytically ( 6th all time )
all i ask from these butthurt agenda driven kobe haters is to be CONSISTENT
Greatest Individual Playoff Performance in NBA history - 22y.o = 29.4 ppg, 7.3 rpg, 6.1 apg, 15-1 Record, #1 in Win Shares
FPL wrote:I'm somebody who is pretty high on KG (higher than ElGee, the guy doing these rankings). Here is a mental exercise for you guys:
(1) List your top 30 players.
(2) For each player in your top 30, write down the player in your top 30 that best complements that star.
(3) List the players who are got the most mentions in (2).
Thought process here- the goal is to win multiple championships. If you build a contender that can achieve that goal, you're probably going to need at least 2 all-time great players. Of course you need a good supporting cast, but the better your top two guys complement one another, the less you need from your role players.
where would you rank scottie pippen all time with this formula
- ability to play multiple positions
- versatility
- playmaking
- perimeter and post defense
- ball handling
- shooting
- posting up
- rebounding
- length
- unselfishness
and no accomplishments are factored in... just straight up player attributes
and btw.. the best complimentary player to a big man in nba history is early 2000's kobe. no other player could average 30ppg and not be a distraction or take away from the flow of the offense. let the big man get all the love and still do his job accordingly
imagine jordan with shaq... or lebron with shaq... their agendas would kill the team
Last edited by Lamelo_Ball on Sat Mar 17, 2018 3:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Greatest Individual Playoff Performance in NBA history - 22y.o = 29.4 ppg, 7.3 rpg, 6.1 apg, 15-1 Record, #1 in Win Shares
FPL wrote:I'm somebody who is pretty high on KG (higher than ElGee, the guy doing these rankings). Here is a mental exercise for you guys:
(1) List your top 30 players.
(2) For each player in your top 30, write down the player in your top 30 that best complements that star.
(3) List the players who are got the most mentions in (2).
Thought process here- the goal is to win multiple championships. If you build a contender that can achieve that goal, you're probably going to need at least 2 all-time great players. Of course you need a good supporting cast, but the better your top two guys complement one another, the less you need from your role players.
where would you rank scottie pippen all time with this formula
- ability to play multiple positions
- versatility
- playmaking
- perimeter and post defense
- ball handling
- shooting
- posting up
- rebounding
- length - unselfishness
and no accomplishments are factored in... just straight up player attributes
PRO BASKETBALL; Disgusted Pippen Sits Down For Game-Winning Play
FPL wrote:I'm somebody who is pretty high on KG (higher than ElGee, the guy doing these rankings). Here is a mental exercise for you guys:
(1) List your top 30 players.
(2) For each player in your top 30, write down the player in your top 30 that best complements that star.
(3) List the players who are got the most mentions in (2).
Thought process here- the goal is to win multiple championships. If you build a contender that can achieve that goal, you're probably going to need at least 2 all-time great players. Of course you need a good supporting cast, but the better your top two guys complement one another, the less you need from your role players.
where would you rank scottie pippen all time with this formula
- ability to play multiple positions
- versatility
- playmaking
- perimeter and post defense
- ball handling
- shooting
- posting up
- rebounding
- length - unselfishness
and no accomplishments are factored in... just straight up player attributes
PRO BASKETBALL; Disgusted Pippen Sits Down For Game-Winning Play
like jim jackson told nick wright.. there isn't a single player in nba history that doesn't have atleast one bad moment
but as for that specific moment. pippen sacrificed his entire career and took it like no other man would have... any other guy as good as pippen gets tired of winning as the 2nd banana
but he didn't.. he never took a ton of shots. always scored within the flow of the game.
i think at the time pippen felt like he earned the right to make the right decision out there. kukoc wasn't proven yet by any stretch
infact he was a rookie at the time
i don't blame scottie... lucky for him and them he made the shot
other than that pippens track record is flawless
Greatest Individual Playoff Performance in NBA history - 22y.o = 29.4 ppg, 7.3 rpg, 6.1 apg, 15-1 Record, #1 in Win Shares
Lamelo_Ball wrote:where would you rank scottie pippen all time with this formula
and no accomplishments are factored in... just straight up player attributes
- ability to play multiple positions Probably historically notable. Top 25 at worst.
- versatility I think his versatility offensively is a bit overrated. He needs the ball in his hand to have an impact.
- playmaking Solid for his position, but not top 50 all-time.
- perimeter and post defense I think he's overrated, but probably would say he's a top 10 wing defender all-time.
- ball handling Very good for his position.
- shooting Pretty bad. The three wasn't defended as closely, and if you take out the seasons with the shortened line, he's at .302 for his career.
- posting up He wasn't a great post-up player. He had decent footwork, but he couldn't anchor your offense on the block.
- rebounding I don't think he was particularly skilled or unskilled as a rebounder. The team philosophy on those Bulls teams was to let him and MJ crash the boards, and get out in transition.
- length Definitely elite.
- unselfishness Eh, I just keep thinking of 94 and how he cried about Kukoc getting the shot.
Lamelo_Ball wrote:where would you rank scottie pippen all time with this formula
and no accomplishments are factored in... just straight up player attributes
- ability to play multiple positions Probably historically notable. Top 25 at worst.
- versatility I think his versatility offensively is a bit overrated. He needs the ball in his hand to have an impact.
- playmaking Solid for his position, but not top 50 all-time.
- perimeter and post defense I think he's overrated, but probably would say he's a top 10 wing defender all-time.
- ball handling Very good for his position.
- shooting Pretty bad. The three wasn't defended as closely, and if you take out the seasons with the shortened line, he's at .302 for his career.
- posting up He wasn't a great post-up player. He had decent footwork, but he couldn't anchor your offense on the block.
- rebounding I don't think he was particularly skilled or unskilled as a rebounder. The team philosophy on those Bulls teams was to let him and MJ crash the boards, and get out in transition.
- length Definitely elite. - unselfishness Eh, I just keep thinking of 94 and how he cried about Kukoc getting the shot.
Bill Cartwright who was one bad hombre cried in the locker room and kept saying "I can't believe he did that to coach."
