What would these greats of yore stat lines look like in today's NBA ?

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vcsgrizzfan
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Re: What would these greats of yore stat lines look like in today's NBA ?

Post by vcsgrizzfan »

Lamelo_Ball wrote:
vcsgrizzfan wrote:Jordan - 30-33 ppg on something over 50% shooting. We've basically lived with MJ-lite in DWade. Jordan is just a better version. The extra FTAs and lower FGAs (A result of more foul calls on his driving in this era) benefits him a lot. His points per shot would be extremely high as a result.

Bird - agree with Bush and others. His game translates beautifully.

I think Hakeem and Kareem take a slight dip just because they get fewer touches in an era that emphasizes the three so much and the post less.

Wilt takes a more meaningful dip for the reasons Bush alluded to.

Magic is hard to gauge for me. That incredible basketball IQ should translate in any era but the lack of range hurts a little. His assists take "some" hit but I'm not sure how much. He's be harder to hide defensively in an era where almost every guard can put it on the deck and drive and the floor is much more spread.


wade hasn't been "that guy" since about 2009 ... 2012 was the year we started seeing the transition to the new soft era/analytical shit... weeding out long 2's etc...


wade stopped being elite pretty much right then and there TBH


you're on crack... you actually think jordan puts up his career average ( OR BETTER ) in todays league?

:yaoyao:
A little higher than his career average on virtually every metric. He would absolutely feast in an era with less crowded paint. I'm especially talking first 3peat and younger MJ. And Wade just lost a step from injury and age.

You're a trolling moron Griff.
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Re: What would these greats of yore stat lines look like in today's NBA ?

Post by Bush4Ever35 »

Lamelo_Ball wrote:

you're on crack... you actually think jordan puts up his career average ( OR BETTER ) in todays league?
Coming from the guy that says Bird would average 19 points per game...
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Re: What would these greats of yore stat lines look like in today's NBA ?

Post by rtiff68 »

vcsgrizzfan wrote:Jordan - 30-33 ppg on something over 50% shooting. We've basically lived with MJ-lite in DWade. Jordan is just a better version. The extra FTAs and lower FGAs (A result of more foul calls on his driving in this era) benefits him a lot. His points per shot would be extremely high as a result.

Bird - agree with Bush and others. His game translates beautifully.

I think Hakeem and Kareem take a slight dip just because they get fewer touches in an era that emphasizes the three so much and the post less.

Wilt takes a more meaningful dip for the reasons Bush alluded to.

Magic is hard to gauge for me. That incredible basketball IQ should translate in any era but the lack of range hurts a little. His assists take "some" hit but I'm not sure how much. He's be harder to hide defensively in an era where almost every guard can put it on the deck and drive and the floor is much more spread.
Magic is definitely the toughest to predict.

When you aren't a great defender, you're not an elite scorer in general, and you are a decidedly below average jump shooter, it's hard to see you thriving as a guard today, even if other areas are off of the charts.

For whatever reason, I've always thought that Magic gets the biggest pass of all the "all time greats" when discussing how games would translate across eras. Kobe's shot selection gets ripped (rightfully so), Shaq's laziness gets ripped (rightfully so), Bird's lack of athleticism gets ripped, Russell's lack of scoring, Jordan and Oscar for their limited range, etc...

...Magic seems to always find himself in almost all "top 5's" despite only being a star for 12 years, only leading his team in scoring 3 times, and never being any better than an average defender despite his tremendous physical advantage at his position (not to mention the "quality" of the conference he played in).
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Re: What would these greats of yore stat lines look like in today's NBA ?

Post by Sudanese Sensation »

DeMar DeRozan is to peak Wade what Dwight Howard was to peak Shaq.
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Re: What would these greats of yore stat lines look like in today's NBA ?

Post by dwcmwa »

Jordan would seriously be unstoppable, especially with the way fouls are called these days.

No weaknesses, I'm talking crazy numbers.


As far as the other guys, big increases as well.
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Re: What would these greats of yore stat lines look like in today's NBA ?

Post by thedangerouskitchen »

dwcmwa wrote:Jordan would seriously be unstoppable, especially with the way fouls are called these days.

No weaknesses, I'm talking crazy numbers.



As far as the other guys, big increases as well.
No doubt about it...

Hell, if Westbrook can average 30/10/10 on 43% / 33% shooting combined this season and last, Jordan's line would be literally insane... we're talking 35/10/10 ish without question, on 55%-60% shooting overall, averaging about 15 FTA a game.

Larry Bird would also do legendary damage to the stat sheet, playing in an era where the perimeter defenders can't touch you... he would likely be the first 60% / 50% / 90% shooter ever.
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Re: What would these greats of yore stat lines look like in today's NBA ?

Post by Master Spade »

Jordan: 42/11/10 on 57%

Even players that are not "All Time Greats" would be alot better in this NBA. Players like Arvydas Sabonis and Toni Kukoc come to mind. They were already used to this kind of basketball.

Put those 2 in today's NBA and watch out!!
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Re: What would these greats of yore stat lines look like in today's NBA ?

Post by AbeVigodaLive »

Shill Jackson wrote:I don't agree on Wilt. His rebounding might suffer a bit due to the increased outside shooting emphasis, but he'd still be dominant, and his assists would likely increase as he kicks it outside.
Points - he was incredibly athletic and a finesse scorer. Unlikely to change much.

Wilt Chamberlain routinely beat Jerry West in 25-foot jump shooting contests. In fact, I think he beat him EVERY time.

Seriously. Wilt said that himself. And why would he lie about something like that. Why would a guy like him lie about anything.



[Note: Back to the main topic... Bird would be my pick as well. We've discussed it before... but he'd fit very well with this era. Imagine the three point chops of a better Ryan Anderson and better passing of a Nikola Jokic type? Not bad.]
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Re: What would these greats of yore stat lines look like in today's NBA ?

Post by AbeVigodaLive »

The very best players transcend eras. A few things:

- Magic Johnson took off 4.5 years. Gained about 60 pounds. Was battling HIV. And switched from PG to PF.
14.6 ppg / 5.7 reb / 6.9 ast / 46.6% fg / 37.9% 3fg

- Old Wilt did pretty well vs. Young Kareem. Older Kareem did pretty well vs. young Hakeem. Older Hakeem did pretty well vs. young Shaq. Now, granted, the big man era is over. But in a league where rim-runners like Rudy Gobert and Deeandre Jordan are All NBA guys and a guy like Andre Drummond does well... there's plenty of room for Wilt. He's still 7'2"... still athletic. And even has better trainers, nutrition, sleep, women, et al...

- Hakeem might have to change his game more than Wilt. The mid-range jump-shot-center really is a dying breed. Could he extend the range to three? Meh. A lot of scouts look at free throw shooting as a barometer of shooting potential. Olajuwon was only a 71% shooter. And I don't think he was a great passer consistently. He'd still be a great player... I just don't see him looking anything like what he looked like 20+ years ago.

- As noted, Demar Derozan does fine. (27/5/4 last season) Michael Jordan > Demar Derozan. He'd be just fine, even without a great three point shot. Heck, I also saw Russell Westbrook mentioned. That guy shoots 31.1% on three pointers. Jordan shot 32.7% for his career (even if it's artificially inflated during the 3 years the NBA moved the line closer.)

- I'm downright giddy imagining Bird in today's game.
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Re: What would these greats of yore stat lines look like in today's NBA ?

Post by Bush4Ever35 »

AbeVigodaLive wrote:The very best players transcend eras. A few things:

- Magic Johnson took off 4.5 years. Gained about 60 pounds. Was battling HIV. And switched from PG to PF.
14.6 ppg / 5.7 reb / 6.9 ast / 46.6% fg / 37.9% 3fg
Regarding Magic, I don't really think the shifts in era really took place between 1991 and 1996 are even a fraction of what they would be between 1991 and 2018.

We aren't really talking about time periods that bleed into one way like Wilt/Kareem or Kareem/Hakeem.

We are talking about big conceptual shifts.

That being said, I'm reasonably confident he could have developed a three-point shot. He started to towards the end of his career, but not in today's volume. Defensively...he would be in bigger trouble I think.

http://www.backpicks.com/2018/01/15/bac ... c-johnson/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; (love this guy's work)
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Re: What would these greats of yore stat lines look like in today's NBA ?

Post by Sudanese Sensation »

Bush4Ever35 wrote:
AbeVigodaLive wrote:The very best players transcend eras. A few things:

- Magic Johnson took off 4.5 years. Gained about 60 pounds. Was battling HIV. And switched from PG to PF.
14.6 ppg / 5.7 reb / 6.9 ast / 46.6% fg / 37.9% 3fg
Regarding Magic, I don't really think the shifts in era really took place between 1991 and 1996 are even a fraction of what they would be between 1991 and 2018.

We aren't really talking about time periods that bleed into one way like Wilt/Kareem or Kareem/Hakeem.

We are talking about big conceptual shifts.

That being said, I'm reasonably confident he could have developed a three-point shot. He started to towards the end of his career, but not in today's volume. Defensively...he would be in bigger trouble I think.

http://www.backpicks.com/2018/01/15/bac ... c-johnson/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; (love this guy's work)
He would cause match up nightmares on offense. You can't guard him with a one guard. That means you have to guard him with a three or four.
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Re: What would these greats of yore stat lines look like in today's NBA ?

Post by AbeVigodaLive »

Bush4Ever35 wrote:
AbeVigodaLive wrote:The very best players transcend eras. A few things:

- Magic Johnson took off 4.5 years. Gained about 60 pounds. Was battling HIV. And switched from PG to PF.
14.6 ppg / 5.7 reb / 6.9 ast / 46.6% fg / 37.9% 3fg
Regarding Magic, I don't really think the shifts in era really took place between 1991 and 1996 are even a fraction of what they would be between 1991 and 2018.

We aren't really talking about time periods that bleed into one way like Wilt/Kareem or Kareem/Hakeem.

We are talking about big conceptual shifts.

That being said, I'm reasonably confident he could have developed a three-point shot. He started to towards the end of his career, but not in today's volume. Defensively...he would be in bigger trouble I think.

http://www.backpicks.com/2018/01/15/bac ... c-johnson/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; (love this guy's work)

I'll check out those scouting reports when I have more time. Seem like they'll be a fun read.

I get the changing era angle. And I see where the Magic concern comes in. I was just pointing out that even a fat, out-of-shape Magic found a way to be successful on a playoff team after taking years off. A young Magic in his prime would find a way to be successful in any era. Top 5 all-time? Well... maybe not. But he'd be an All Star in any era.

Defensively? Ryan Anderson has played for 10 years now, right? He's about the same size as Magic Johnson. Magic wouldn't be guarding Damian Lillard and Steph Curry... he'd be guarding much bigger, slower players.
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Re: What would these greats of yore stat lines look like in today's NBA ?

Post by Bush4Ever35 »

Yeah, I agree with most of that.

It's interesting to think about.

Legends are always going to hit the threshold of "great" in any era, but on the margins if they would get a bump up vs. down is interesting to think about. I think Magic would get a small bump down...while still being great on the whole.

I don't think there is a prayer in hell of Wilt maintaining his 35/15 type seasons, or even 31 PER type seasons though.

The game has simply moved on from that model of team offense and volume scoring, and rightfully so. Even in Wilt's era, he didn't move team offenses the way that someone would expect on the surface from such magnificent numbers, at least until he moved away from volume scoring and black holeing :D
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Re: What would these greats of yore stat lines look like in today's NBA ?

Post by vcsgrizzfan »

Master Spade wrote:Jordan: 42/11/10 on 57%

Even players that are not "All Time Greats" would be alot better in this NBA. Players like Arvydas Sabonis and Toni Kukoc come to mind. They were already used to this kind of basketball.

Put those 2 in today's NBA and watch out!!
The retards are out in full force ITT.
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Re: What would these greats of yore stat lines look like in today's NBA ?

Post by Sudanese Sensation »

vcsgrizzfan wrote:
Master Spade wrote:Jordan: 42/11/10 on 57%

Even players that are not "All Time Greats" would be alot better in this NBA. Players like Arvydas Sabonis and Toni Kukoc come to mind. They were already used to this kind of basketball.

Put those 2 in today's NBA and watch out!!
The retards are out in full force ITT.

:shock:
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Re: What would these greats of yore stat lines look like in today's NBA ?

Post by vcsgrizzfan »

Sudanese Sensation wrote:
vcsgrizzfan wrote:
Master Spade wrote:Jordan: 42/11/10 on 57%

Even players that are not "All Time Greats" would be alot better in this NBA. Players like Arvydas Sabonis and Toni Kukoc come to mind. They were already used to this kind of basketball.

Put those 2 in today's NBA and watch out!!
The retards are out in full force ITT.

:shock:
TDK and Master Spade at one end of the spectrum and Griff on the other. Equally stupid.
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Re: What would these greats of yore stat lines look like in today's NBA ?

Post by Master Spade »

vcsgrizzfan wrote:
Master Spade wrote:Jordan: 42/11/10 on 57%

Even players that are not "All Time Greats" would be alot better in this NBA. Players like Arvydas Sabonis and Toni Kukoc come to mind. They were already used to this kind of basketball.

Put those 2 in today's NBA and watch out!!
The retards are out in full force ITT.
I agree. Those retards in this thread just can't handle the Truth. They just can't handle the fact that the rule changes since the 00's have inflated players individual #'s.


But let's have mercy on them.


8-)
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Re: What would these greats of yore stat lines look like in today's NBA ?

Post by Da Stars. »

Jordan would average 34/8/8. Maybe 36. Maybe.
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Re: What would these greats of yore stat lines look like in today's NBA ?

Post by Da Stars. »

JUst food for thought. What would happen in KAJ had a shot out to 15 feet. Wilt out to ten feet. And Hakeem a three point shot.
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Re: What would these greats of yore stat lines look like in today's NBA ?

Post by vcsgrizzfan »

Master Spade wrote:
vcsgrizzfan wrote:
Master Spade wrote:Jordan: 42/11/10 on 57%

Even players that are not "All Time Greats" would be alot better in this NBA. Players like Arvydas Sabonis and Toni Kukoc come to mind. They were already used to this kind of basketball.

Put those 2 in today's NBA and watch out!!
The retards are out in full force ITT.
I agree. Those retards in this thread just can't handle the Truth. They just can't handle the fact that the rule changes since the 00's have inflated players individual #'s.


But let's have mercy on them.


8-)
You're a moron. Nothing else needs to be added.
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