Irrefutable evidence/proof why the 90's were better and tougher than today's weak, sissy NBA

Talk about anything here.
Post Reply
thedangerouskitchen
G.O.A.T.
Posts: 42659
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 8:32 pm

Re: Irrefutable evidence/proof why the 90's were better and tougher than today's weak, sissy NBA

Post by thedangerouskitchen »

LeBronMonsterDunk wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 12:44 pm
thedangerouskitchen wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 12:42 pm
LeBronMonsterDunk wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 12:31 pm

What kind of retard would be taking those kinds of shots?
The rules/style back then made it so that players were actually allowed to play tough, hard, physical Defense, and as a result many more shots were contested (making it harder to score) vs. today, where the style / rules in place have made it easier than ever to Score.

Pretty basic stuff, actually.
So the players "back then" just weren't good enough to take better shots, or were they just stupid and didn't know long mid range shots were the worst shot in basketball?
Players play in real time... they don't have the benefit of hindsight. The game style/rules were different back then. Defenders were allowed to be very physical / lots of contact, and that alone makes it harder to get a shot off (and make the shot) vs. playing in a soft/weak league where zero contact is allowed and there's enough spacing to drive a truck in the paint, which again, makes it much easier to shoot/score.

This is not rocket science.
"Today's NBA is soft, the Defense is weak, and the rules 'really' favor the Offense."

"Lebron doesn’t guard for a full game and our game plan was to get him to play defense and he left me open all game."
User avatar
Robceltsfan
Pick 'Em League Champion
Posts: 52303
Joined: Sun Jan 19, 2014 8:42 am
Location: Hampton Roads, VA

Re: Irrefutable evidence/proof why the 90's were better and tougher than today's weak, sissy NBA

Post by Robceltsfan »

thedangerouskitchen wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 1:05 pm
LeBronMonsterDunk wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 12:44 pm
thedangerouskitchen wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 12:42 pm

The rules/style back then made it so that players were actually allowed to play tough, hard, physical Defense, and as a result many more shots were contested (making it harder to score) vs. today, where the style / rules in place have made it easier than ever to Score.

Pretty basic stuff, actually.
So the players "back then" just weren't good enough to take better shots, or were they just stupid and didn't know long mid range shots were the worst shot in basketball?
Players play in real time... they don't have the benefit of hindsight. The game style/rules were different back then. Defenders were allowed to be very physical / lots of contact, and that alone makes it harder to get a shot off (and make the shot) vs. playing in a soft/weak league where zero contact is allowed and there's enough spacing to drive a truck in the paint, which again, makes it much easier to shoot/score.

This is not rocket science.
TDK dodging the question again! 90's players/coaches were MORONS. :lol:
Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are dumber than that.

~George Carlin~
thedangerouskitchen
G.O.A.T.
Posts: 42659
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 8:32 pm

Re: Irrefutable evidence/proof why the 90's were better and tougher than today's weak, sissy NBA

Post by thedangerouskitchen »

Robceltsfan wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 1:00 pm
thedangerouskitchen wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 12:48 pm
_Vcsgrizzfan_ wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 12:34 pm

You are confused. The 3 point line is generally defended more vigorously than in any era in history. Certainly much more closely than in the 80s and 90s. The whole reason offenses are more successful is that so much more of the court has to be defended. Defending from 2-3 feet beyond the arc and in is much more taxing on the defense than guarding 16 feet and in. With good ball movement and inside out play, you will get your fair share of wide open 3s, but that is because of good offense and more court to cover.
There's waaaaay more wide-open shots taken today than ever before... as you said, the spacing makes it much harder for the Defense (and by default, much easier for the Offense).

Thanks for proving my point (and Silver's, Dumars', Gobert's, Kerr's, River's, etc) about today's weak/soft Defense.
This dumb ass contradicted himself in just two sentences. :lol:

Better spacing = better offense = harder on defense


None of that means "weak/soft defense".


You gotta make up your mind, TDK. :lol:
I never said "better" Offense lumpy, you did... I said weak/soft Defense makes it "easier" to Score.

Fact.

Next...
"Today's NBA is soft, the Defense is weak, and the rules 'really' favor the Offense."

"Lebron doesn’t guard for a full game and our game plan was to get him to play defense and he left me open all game."
User avatar
Robceltsfan
Pick 'Em League Champion
Posts: 52303
Joined: Sun Jan 19, 2014 8:42 am
Location: Hampton Roads, VA

Re: Irrefutable evidence/proof why the 90's were better and tougher than today's weak, sissy NBA

Post by Robceltsfan »

thedangerouskitchen wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 1:10 pm
Robceltsfan wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 1:00 pm
thedangerouskitchen wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 12:48 pm

There's waaaaay more wide-open shots taken today than ever before... as you said, the spacing makes it much harder for the Defense (and by default, much easier for the Offense).

Thanks for proving my point (and Silver's, Dumars', Gobert's, Kerr's, River's, etc) about today's weak/soft Defense.
This dumb ass contradicted himself in just two sentences. :lol:

Better spacing = better offense = harder on defense


None of that means "weak/soft defense".


You gotta make up your mind, TDK. :lol:
I never said "better" Offense lumpy, you did... I said weak/soft Defense makes it "easier" to Score.

Fact.

Next...
No, you specifically said "spacing makes it much harder for the Defense".

Spacing is CREATED BY THE OFFENSE, no?
Making things harder on the defense is a good thing for an offense to do, no?

So, therefore, better spacing = better offense.

You can't tiptoe around it.
Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are dumber than that.

~George Carlin~
User avatar
zombiesonics
Mount Rushmore
Posts: 32247
Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2014 1:56 pm

Re: Irrefutable evidence/proof why the 90's were better and tougher than today's weak, sissy NBA

Post by zombiesonics »

Damn, so not only were ‘90s players smaller, weaker, less athletic and less talented, they also had lower b-ball IQs and took worse shots.

Wow.. !!
thedangerouskitchen
G.O.A.T.
Posts: 42659
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 8:32 pm

Re: Irrefutable evidence/proof why the 90's were better and tougher than today's weak, sissy NBA

Post by thedangerouskitchen »

Robceltsfan wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 1:07 pm
thedangerouskitchen wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 1:01 pm
Bush4Ever. wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 12:47 pm

Uhh...yeah a 2-3 percentage point difference over approximately 500-600K free throws (50K-60K FTs shot per year) against 200K free throws shot in the 2020s is actually a gigantic statistical difference.

lol
Taken team-by-team and the difference is minimal.

22 FTA at a .784% clip (2024) = 17.2 Points
22 FTA at a .765% clip (1991) = 16.8 Points

Yeah, huge difference.

:L

Next...
Except is was more like 27-28 attempts during the "hammer players all you want with no fouls called" 90's.....and you picked THE BEST year from the 90's for the 76.5%. It was sub-74% for most of the 90's.

4.4% over 28 attempts per game is 22.0 versus 20.7 points per game. Do you know how many teams would KILL for an extra 1.3 points per game, EVERY game, guaranteed?

The answer: all of them
I also picked the best year for FT% in this era - ie; 2024... and it's common sense that when the game is tougher and more physical (ie; the 90's) then more fouls will be called.

D'OH!

Also... FT% was below 74% just one (1) year in the 90's (ie; .734% in 94, when MJ was retired - lol).. and an extra 1.3 PPG is NOT an example of a league "allegedly" so much more talented/skilled as you claim today's NBA is. In fact adding an additional 1.3 PPG to the Top 10 seeds in the NBA today would not change a thing with respect to their Average Margin of Victory, so it's trivial at best. Just another example of you/others grasping at straws to try and take away from the harsh criticism of today's game (from the Commish, the VP of Ops, and many current players/coaches).

Next...
"Today's NBA is soft, the Defense is weak, and the rules 'really' favor the Offense."

"Lebron doesn’t guard for a full game and our game plan was to get him to play defense and he left me open all game."
User avatar
Robceltsfan
Pick 'Em League Champion
Posts: 52303
Joined: Sun Jan 19, 2014 8:42 am
Location: Hampton Roads, VA

Re: Irrefutable evidence/proof why the 90's were better and tougher than today's weak, sissy NBA

Post by Robceltsfan »

thedangerouskitchen wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 1:20 pm
Robceltsfan wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 1:07 pm
thedangerouskitchen wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 1:01 pm

Taken team-by-team and the difference is minimal.

22 FTA at a .784% clip (2024) = 17.2 Points
22 FTA at a .765% clip (1991) = 16.8 Points

Yeah, huge difference.

:L

Next...
Except is was more like 27-28 attempts during the "hammer players all you want with no fouls called" 90's.....and you picked THE BEST year from the 90's for the 76.5%. It was sub-74% for most of the 90's.

4.4% over 28 attempts per game is 22.0 versus 20.7 points per game. Do you know how many teams would KILL for an extra 1.3 points per game, EVERY game, guaranteed?

The answer: all of them
I also picked the best year for FT% in this era - ie; 2024... and it's common sense that when the game is tougher and more physical (ie; the 90's) then more fouls will be called.

D'OH!

Also... FT% was below 74% just one (1) year in the 90's (ie; .734% in 94, when MJ was retired - lol).. and an extra 1.3 PPG is NOT an example of a league "allegedly" so much more talented/skilled as you claim today's NBA is. In fact adding an additional 1.3 PPG to the Top 10 seeds in the NBA today would not change a thing with respect to their Average Margin of Victory, so it's trivial at best. Just another example of you/others grasping at straws to try and take away from the harsh criticism of today's game (from the Commish, the VP of Ops, and many current players/coaches).

Next...
The 90's saw SIX (6) seasons shooting 74.0% or worse including all three seasons of Jordan's second three-peat.

You are a moron or a liar. You pick.
Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are dumber than that.

~George Carlin~
thedangerouskitchen
G.O.A.T.
Posts: 42659
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 8:32 pm

Re: Irrefutable evidence/proof why the 90's were better and tougher than today's weak, sissy NBA

Post by thedangerouskitchen »

Robceltsfan wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 1:13 pm
thedangerouskitchen wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 1:10 pm
Robceltsfan wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 1:00 pm

This dumb ass contradicted himself in just two sentences. :lol:

Better spacing = better offense = harder on defense


None of that means "weak/soft defense".


You gotta make up your mind, TDK. :lol:
I never said "better" Offense lumpy, you did... I said weak/soft Defense makes it "easier" to Score.

Fact.

Next...
No, you specifically said "spacing makes it much harder for the Defense".

Spacing is CREATED BY THE OFFENSE, no?
Making things harder on the defense is a good thing for an offense to do, no?

So, therefore, better spacing = better offense.

You can't tiptoe around it.
You can go round in circles all you want but the fact remains the NBA's very own Commissioner, its VP of Ops, and several current players/coaches all spoke out about how the rules in place today heavily favor the Offense, which means that it's easier to Score.

You can't tiptoe around it.
"Today's NBA is soft, the Defense is weak, and the rules 'really' favor the Offense."

"Lebron doesn’t guard for a full game and our game plan was to get him to play defense and he left me open all game."
thedangerouskitchen
G.O.A.T.
Posts: 42659
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 8:32 pm

Re: Irrefutable evidence/proof why the 90's were better and tougher than today's weak, sissy NBA

Post by thedangerouskitchen »

Robceltsfan wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 1:13 pm
thedangerouskitchen wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 1:10 pm
Robceltsfan wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 1:00 pm

This dumb ass contradicted himself in just two sentences. :lol:

Better spacing = better offense = harder on defense


None of that means "weak/soft defense".


You gotta make up your mind, TDK. :lol:
I never said "better" Offense lumpy, you did... I said weak/soft Defense makes it "easier" to Score.

Fact.

Next...
No, you specifically said "spacing makes it much harder for the Defense".

Spacing is CREATED BY THE OFFENSE, no?
Making things harder on the defense is a good thing for an offense to do, no?

So, therefore, better spacing = better offense.

You can't tiptoe around it.
You can go round in circles all you want but the fact remains the NBA's very own Commissioner, its VP of Ops, and several current players/coaches all spoke out about how the rules in place today heavily favor the Offense, which means that it's easier to Score.

You can't tiptoe around it.
"Today's NBA is soft, the Defense is weak, and the rules 'really' favor the Offense."

"Lebron doesn’t guard for a full game and our game plan was to get him to play defense and he left me open all game."
User avatar
LeBronMonsterDunk
Clean-Up Crew
Posts: 54342
Joined: Sat Jul 12, 2014 12:19 am

Re: Irrefutable evidence/proof why the 90's were better and tougher than today's weak, sissy NBA

Post by LeBronMonsterDunk »

Losing the debate and shook so badly he's double posting lol
You never liked me, probably don't like me still, but a ***** liking me aint never paid my bills
User avatar
Robceltsfan
Pick 'Em League Champion
Posts: 52303
Joined: Sun Jan 19, 2014 8:42 am
Location: Hampton Roads, VA

Re: Irrefutable evidence/proof why the 90's were better and tougher than today's weak, sissy NBA

Post by Robceltsfan »

LeBronMonsterDunk wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 1:27 pm Losing the debate and shook so badly he's double posting lol
That's his second double post. He must be furious!!! :lol:
Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are dumber than that.

~George Carlin~
thedangerouskitchen
G.O.A.T.
Posts: 42659
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 8:32 pm

Re: Irrefutable evidence/proof why the 90's were better and tougher than today's weak, sissy NBA

Post by thedangerouskitchen »

Robceltsfan wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 1:23 pm
thedangerouskitchen wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 1:20 pm
Robceltsfan wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 1:07 pm

Except is was more like 27-28 attempts during the "hammer players all you want with no fouls called" 90's.....and you picked THE BEST year from the 90's for the 76.5%. It was sub-74% for most of the 90's.

4.4% over 28 attempts per game is 22.0 versus 20.7 points per game. Do you know how many teams would KILL for an extra 1.3 points per game, EVERY game, guaranteed?

The answer: all of them
I also picked the best year for FT% in this era - ie; 2024... and it's common sense that when the game is tougher and more physical (ie; the 90's) then more fouls will be called.

D'OH!

Also... FT% was below 74% just one (1) year in the 90's (ie; .734% in 94, when MJ was retired - lol).. and an extra 1.3 PPG is NOT an example of a league "allegedly" so much more talented/skilled as you claim today's NBA is. In fact adding an additional 1.3 PPG to the Top 10 seeds in the NBA today would not change a thing with respect to their Average Margin of Victory, so it's trivial at best. Just another example of you/others grasping at straws to try and take away from the harsh criticism of today's game (from the Commish, the VP of Ops, and many current players/coaches).

Next...
The 90's saw SIX (6) seasons shooting 74.0% or worse including all three seasons of Jordan's second three-peat.

You are a moron or a liar. You pick.
I'm rounding up 73.7 and 73.8 to 74%... and REGARDLESS, an extra 1.3 PPG wouldn't mean diddly squat to the Top 10 teams in the league today (ie; the teams you'd consider contenders for the most part).

You're grasping at straws.

Face facts: Weak and soft Defense leads to easier Scoring.
"Today's NBA is soft, the Defense is weak, and the rules 'really' favor the Offense."

"Lebron doesn’t guard for a full game and our game plan was to get him to play defense and he left me open all game."
User avatar
Robceltsfan
Pick 'Em League Champion
Posts: 52303
Joined: Sun Jan 19, 2014 8:42 am
Location: Hampton Roads, VA

Re: Irrefutable evidence/proof why the 90's were better and tougher than today's weak, sissy NBA

Post by Robceltsfan »

He was ROUNDING UP you guys!!!!


:lol: :lol: :lol:
Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are dumber than that.

~George Carlin~
thedangerouskitchen
G.O.A.T.
Posts: 42659
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 8:32 pm

Re: Irrefutable evidence/proof why the 90's were better and tougher than today's weak, sissy NBA

Post by thedangerouskitchen »

LeBronMonsterDunk wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 1:27 pm Losing the debate and shook so badly he's double posting lol
Wrong genius... there's a problem with my connection or VPN, it's giving me a page-download error every time I hit Submit.

Your very own NBA Commissioner, VP, and several current players and coaches agree with me... why on earth would I be shook?

:lol: :roll: :L
"Today's NBA is soft, the Defense is weak, and the rules 'really' favor the Offense."

"Lebron doesn’t guard for a full game and our game plan was to get him to play defense and he left me open all game."
User avatar
zombiesonics
Mount Rushmore
Posts: 32247
Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2014 1:56 pm

Re: Irrefutable evidence/proof why the 90's were better and tougher than today's weak, sissy NBA

Post by zombiesonics »

LeBronMonsterDunk wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 1:27 pm Losing the debate and shook so badly he's double posting lol
His hands are probably all jittery at this point.

Boring White Guy Club spit roasting TDK again. :laugh3:
thedangerouskitchen
G.O.A.T.
Posts: 42659
Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2014 8:32 pm

Re: Irrefutable evidence/proof why the 90's were better and tougher than today's weak, sissy NBA

Post by thedangerouskitchen »

Robceltsfan wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 1:33 pm He was ROUNDING UP you guys!!!!


:lol: :lol: :lol:
Precisely... as we ALL do on this board.

73.7 = 74%
73.8% = 74%
73.3% = 73%

Your desperation is not a good look, rob.

8-)
"Today's NBA is soft, the Defense is weak, and the rules 'really' favor the Offense."

"Lebron doesn’t guard for a full game and our game plan was to get him to play defense and he left me open all game."
User avatar
Robceltsfan
Pick 'Em League Champion
Posts: 52303
Joined: Sun Jan 19, 2014 8:42 am
Location: Hampton Roads, VA

Re: Irrefutable evidence/proof why the 90's were better and tougher than today's weak, sissy NBA

Post by Robceltsfan »

thedangerouskitchen wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 1:37 pm
Robceltsfan wrote: Tue Mar 19, 2024 1:33 pm He was ROUNDING UP you guys!!!!


:lol: :lol: :lol:
Precisely... as we ALL do on this board.

73.7 = 74%
73.8% = 74%
73.3% = 73%

Your desperation is not a good look, rob.

8-)
What did you do with the 72.8% from 98-99? Round up to 100%? :lol:
Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are dumber than that.

~George Carlin~
User avatar
Bush4Ever.
All-Time Great
Posts: 13006
Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2019 8:37 pm

Re: Irrefutable evidence/proof why the 90's were better and tougher than today's weak, sissy NBA

Post by Bush4Ever. »

The difference between 90s FT shooting and 2020s to-date is 3.2 percentage points
https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/nba-le ... -by-decade

That's a galaxy-sized large effect size across many hundreds of thousands of events (FTs).

BTW, the difference between the 1990s and 1950s was only 1.4 percentage points.
Post Reply