Phoenix with the most impressive win of the season...

[AbeVigodaLive]

How impressive was Phoenix's win over the Pacers last night?

- Road game vs. NBA best team.
- Tail end of back-to-back road games.
- 4th road game in 5 days.
- Final game of a long, quick road trip. Classic "scheduled loss" game where even a 3 - 1 record on the trip would have been a success... nope. They went 4 - 0 on the trip.
- 2nd time they beat NBA's best team in 8 days.
- Without Bledsoe.

Now, Phoenix plays 11 of its next 14 games at home. I can't remember the last time I was this surprised by a team's extended success. If I had a vote, Hornacek would be my runaway winner of COY.

I know this thread will go largely ignored... but Phoenix deserves some love.

[kobeunderbite]

Admirable effort from the team but they will never compete for a title with this roster and are losing the opportunity to draft a superstar by playing competitively this season. They will be stuck in purgatory and the 1st round unless something changes.

Yes, I am advocating tanking.

[elartman1973]

Only impressive to those who vastly overrate the pacers

[Deez]

For anyone to win in Indiana is a great win but for Phoenix it's a really big win. They can be a solid team but just won't get it done in a series come playoff time.

[AbeVigodaLive]

Only impressive to those who vastly overrate the pacers

Actually, I was more impressed with them winning the 4th game in 5 nights... all on the road than who they did it against.
They swept back-to-back back-to-backs on the road. That is very rare... regardless of who a team is playing.

Think of it this way... Phoenix was picked by most to have about the same record as Orlando this preseason. Maybe worse. They have 33% of Orlando's season's win total... in a span of 5 days.

Sure, Orlando will probably land a better draft prospect. But that's kind of a slap in the face to fans. "Hey, we're going to push this Promise of Hope campaign and HOPE to be good someday" vs. just going out there, exceeding expectations and being good.



[Note: I'm disappointed in Orlando this season. They have so many young pieces, and added more with Oladipo... yet they aren't winning much more than last season. So, either (1) those promising guys aren't as good as we thought, or (2) a losing culture has hit the locker room. Even if you resort to the nonsense and claim it's by design... sorry... but that's creating a losing culture in the locker room.]

[Deez]

Only impressive to those who vastly overrate the pacers

Actually, I was more impressed with them winning the 4th game in 5 nights... all on the road than who they did it against.
They swept back-to-back back-to-backs on the road. That is very rare... regardless of who a team is playing.

Think of it this way... Phoenix was picked by most to have about the same record as Orlando this preseason. Maybe worse. They have 33% of Orlando's season's win total... in a span of 5 days.

Sure, Orlando will probably land a better draft prospect. But that's kind of a slap in the face to fans. "Hey, we're going to push this Promise of Hope campaign and HOPE to be good someday" vs. just going out there, exceeding expectations and being good.



[Note: I'm disappointed in Orlando this season. They have so many young pieces, and added more with Oladipo... yet they aren't winning much more than last season. So, either (1) those promising guys aren't as good as we thought, or (2) a losing culture has hit the locker room. Even if you resort to the nonsense and claim it's by design... sorry... but that's creating a losing culture in the locker room.]

Orlando is also a garbage team and franchise who won't ever win anything.

[AbeVigodaLive]

For anyone to win in Indiana is a great win but for Phoenix it's a really big win. They can be a solid team but just won't get it done in a series come playoff time.

The team was picked to lose 60 games by A LOT of people.

I can't think of a single person/prognosticator/fan who thought they'd even be a playoff team this season. The team isn't designed to make an extended playoff run. It'll be one of the league's best success stories if they just make the playoffs.

Even if they get swept and lose by 30 per night... I think every Phoenix fan would still be shocked at how well the team performed.

[AbeVigodaLive]

Only impressive to those who vastly overrate the pacers

Actually, I was more impressed with them winning the 4th game in 5 nights... all on the road than who they did it against.
They swept back-to-back back-to-backs on the road. That is very rare... regardless of who a team is playing.

Think of it this way... Phoenix was picked by most to have about the same record as Orlando this preseason. Maybe worse. They have 33% of Orlando's season's win total... in a span of 5 days.

Sure, Orlando will probably land a better draft prospect. But that's kind of a slap in the face to fans. "Hey, we're going to push this Promise of Hope campaign and HOPE to be good someday" vs. just going out there, exceeding expectations and being good.



[Note: I'm disappointed in Orlando this season. They have so many young pieces, and added more with Oladipo... yet they aren't winning much more than last season. So, either (1) those promising guys aren't as good as we thought, or (2) a losing culture has hit the locker room. Even if you resort to the nonsense and claim it's by design... sorry... but that's creating a losing culture in the locker room.]

Orlando is also a garbage team and franchise who won't ever win anything.

And, we're off...

[elartman1973]

Actually, I was more impressed with them winning the 4th game in 5 nights... all on the road than who they did it against.
They swept back-to-back back-to-backs on the road. That is very rare... regardless of who a team is playing.

Think of it this way... Phoenix was picked by most to have about the same record as Orlando this preseason. Maybe worse. They have 33% of Orlando's season's win total... in a span of 5 days.

Sure, Orlando will probably land a better draft prospect. But that's kind of a slap in the face to fans. "Hey, we're going to push this Promise of Hope campaign and HOPE to be good someday" vs. just going out there, exceeding expectations and being good.



[Note: I'm disappointed in Orlando this season. They have so many young pieces, and added more with Oladipo... yet they aren't winning much more than last season. So, either (1) those promising guys aren't as good as we thought, or (2) a losing culture has hit the locker room. Even if you resort to the nonsense and claim it's by design... sorry... but that's creating a losing culture in the locker room.]

Orlando is also a garbage team and franchise who won't ever win anything.

And, we're off...

Nope...im immune to trolling

[AbeVigodaLive]

Orlando is also a garbage team and franchise who won't ever win anything.

And, we're off...

Nope...im immune to trolling

Good. Because I was hoping for a more in-depth basketball discussion vs. the same trolling techniques/cliches/responses we get every day.

[Deez]

Actually, I was more impressed with them winning the 4th game in 5 nights... all on the road than who they did it against.
They swept back-to-back back-to-backs on the road. That is very rare... regardless of who a team is playing.

Think of it this way... Phoenix was picked by most to have about the same record as Orlando this preseason. Maybe worse. They have 33% of Orlando's season's win total... in a span of 5 days.

Sure, Orlando will probably land a better draft prospect. But that's kind of a slap in the face to fans. "Hey, we're going to push this Promise of Hope campaign and HOPE to be good someday" vs. just going out there, exceeding expectations and being good.



[Note: I'm disappointed in Orlando this season. They have so many young pieces, and added more with Oladipo... yet they aren't winning much more than last season. So, either (1) those promising guys aren't as good as we thought, or (2) a losing culture has hit the locker room. Even if you resort to the nonsense and claim it's by design... sorry... but that's creating a losing culture in the locker room.]

Orlando is also a garbage team and franchise who won't ever win anything.

And, we're off...

Why are we off?

[Buckets]

Props to Phoenix for the great start. Its refreshing to see a team play hard when many others are packing it in for the season.

With that said, Abe failed to mention the road trip consisted of Cleveland, Philly, Milwaukee, and Indiana. Always good to go 4-0 on a road trip but outside of Indiana, those were "should" win games against struggling teams.

Again, impressive win and good road trip but lets not overlook the opponents.

[Buckets]

Also I may be a tad biased but I think the Bulls win at San Antonio could be a bit more impressive. With everything going against Thibs this year (Rose injured, team trading its 3rd best player, owner calling team mediocre) he really has taken this challenge head on and gotten players such as Augustine to buy in.

Take into consideration that SA has only lost at home this year to Houston, Indiana, OKC, Knicks, and Blazers (which outside of the Knicks are all pretty good teams) and it shows how tough it is to beat SA at home. Also the Bulls were starting a 6 game road trip.

I know Ginobili and Leonard were out but still impressive nonetheless when you factor in the Bulls situation and that it was at SA

[AtiliusRegulus]

Admirable effort from the team but they will never compete for a title with this roster and are losing the opportunity to draft a superstar by playing competitively this season. They will be stuck in purgatory and the 1st round unless something changes.

Yes, I am advocating tanking.

its all about creating a culture of hard work and winning. Stop buying the folly that Rome was built over night.

[AbeVigodaLive]

Props to Phoenix for the great start. Its refreshing to see a team play hard when many others are packing it in for the season.

With that said, Abe failed to mention the road trip consisted of Cleveland, Philly, Milwaukee, and Indiana. Always good to go 4-0 on a road trip but outside of Indiana, those were "should" win games against struggling teams.

Again, impressive win and good road trip but lets not overlook the opponents.

As noted, 4 wins in 5 nights... all on the road... back-to-back back-to-backs AGAINST any teams... is impressive in today's NBA.

Beating Indiana on the last leg of it, when it was a "schedule loss" just makes it that much more impressive.

[AbeVigodaLive]

Also I may be a tad biased but I think the Bulls win at San Antonio could be a bit more impressive. With everything going against Thibs this year (Rose injured, team trading its 3rd best player, owner calling team mediocre) he really has taken this challenge head on and gotten players such as Augustine to buy in.

Take into consideration that SA has only lost at home this year to Houston, Indiana, OKC, Knicks, and Blazers (which outside of the Knicks are all pretty good teams) and it shows how tough it is to beat SA at home. Also the Bulls were starting a 6 game road trip.

I know Ginobili and Leonard were out but still impressive nonetheless when you factor in the Bulls situation and that it was at SA

No. Don't get me wrong... it was a NICE win. But consider...

- Chicago wasn't playing a back-to-back and traveling overnight to play the game.
- SA WAS playing the tail end of a back-to-back after a big game vs. a conference opponent the previous night.
- SA started Nando De Colo, Othelyis Jeffers and Jeff Ayres.
- The first game on an extended road trip is infinitely easier than the final game on an extended road trip

Maybe you were just trolling though. I hope you were.

[Buckets]

Also I may be a tad biased but I think the Bulls win at San Antonio could be a bit more impressive. With everything going against Thibs this year (Rose injured, team trading its 3rd best player, owner calling team mediocre) he really has taken this challenge head on and gotten players such as Augustine to buy in.

Take into consideration that SA has only lost at home this year to Houston, Indiana, OKC, Knicks, and Blazers (which outside of the Knicks are all pretty good teams) and it shows how tough it is to beat SA at home. Also the Bulls were starting a 6 game road trip.

I know Ginobili and Leonard were out but still impressive nonetheless when you factor in the Bulls situation and that it was at SA

No. Don't get me wrong... it was a NICE win. But consider...

- Chicago wasn't playing a back-to-back and traveling overnight to play the game.
- SA WAS playing the tail end of a back-to-back after a big game vs. a conference opponent the previous night.
- SA started Nando De Colo, Othelyis Jeffers and Jeff Ayres.
- The first game on an extended road trip is infinitely easier than the final game on an extended road trip

Maybe you were just trolling though. I hope you were.

Was trying to add serious basketball discussion. However the Bulls win was less impressive when you add in other factors as you stated. Sall good

[AbeVigodaLive]

Also I may be a tad biased but I think the Bulls win at San Antonio could be a bit more impressive. With everything going against Thibs this year (Rose injured, team trading its 3rd best player, owner calling team mediocre) he really has taken this challenge head on and gotten players such as Augustine to buy in.

Take into consideration that SA has only lost at home this year to Houston, Indiana, OKC, Knicks, and Blazers (which outside of the Knicks are all pretty good teams) and it shows how tough it is to beat SA at home. Also the Bulls were starting a 6 game road trip.

I know Ginobili and Leonard were out but still impressive nonetheless when you factor in the Bulls situation and that it was at SA

No. Don't get me wrong... it was a NICE win. But consider...

- Chicago wasn't playing a back-to-back and traveling overnight to play the game.
- SA WAS playing the tail end of a back-to-back after a big game vs. a conference opponent the previous night.
- SA started Nando De Colo, Othelyis Jeffers and Jeff Ayres.
- The first game on an extended road trip is infinitely easier than the final game on an extended road trip

Maybe you were just trolling though. I hope you were.

Was trying to add serious basketball discussion. However the Bulls win was less impressive when you add in other factors as you stated. Sall good

Cool.

Now all that being said... what Chicago has done this season, even in a weak East, has been impressive. But what they did last year was impressive. And the year before that. Thibodeau has a concrete plan on defense that works... regardless of talent.

So the Bulls keep "overachieving" in the regular season. A lot of times, that can wear out today's modern athletes. But that doesn't seem to have happened in Chicago yet. The guy can definitely coach.

[Buckets]

No. Don't get me wrong... it was a NICE win. But consider...

- Chicago wasn't playing a back-to-back and traveling overnight to play the game.
- SA WAS playing the tail end of a back-to-back after a big game vs. a conference opponent the previous night.
- SA started Nando De Colo, Othelyis Jeffers and Jeff Ayres.
- The first game on an extended road trip is infinitely easier than the final game on an extended road trip

Maybe you were just trolling though. I hope you were.

Was trying to add serious basketball discussion. However the Bulls win was less impressive when you add in other factors as you stated. Sall good

Cool.

Now all that being said... what Chicago has done this season, even in a weak East, has been impressive. But what they did last year was impressive. And the year before that. Thibodeau has a concrete plan on defense that works... regardless of talent.

So the Bulls keep "overachieving" in the regular season. A lot of times, that can wear out today's modern athletes. But that doesn't seem to have happened in Chicago yet. The guy can definitely coach.

I know its commonly stated out there that there's a rift between Thibs and upper management considering management got rid of his top assistant this past offseason without even consulting Thibs.

Now you add in that management took away Thibs favorite player, in addition to the Owner calling the team mediocre and its like they are trying piss him off. I loved the Deng trade so I agree with management there, but then to insult the team publicly is no bueno.

I love Thibs and hope he sticks around but from the outside it sounds like management is trying to piss all over him this year.

That said, I think Thibs motivates players a different way then what other "effort" coaches do. I think he frames it in a way that basically he tells them "you're a professional basketball player and this team is your family. You either play to your potential or you're riding the bench." Also add into the fact that he's gotten players such a Asik, Taj, Korver, Belinelli and Nate Robinson to buy and subsequently get paid and you can see why the players buy in so much.

[AbeVigodaLive]

Was trying to add serious basketball discussion. However the Bulls win was less impressive when you add in other factors as you stated. Sall good

Cool.

Now all that being said... what Chicago has done this season, even in a weak East, has been impressive. But what they did last year was impressive. And the year before that. Thibodeau has a concrete plan on defense that works... regardless of talent.

So the Bulls keep "overachieving" in the regular season. A lot of times, that can wear out today's modern athletes. But that doesn't seem to have happened in Chicago yet. The guy can definitely coach.

I know its commonly stated out there that there's a rift between Thibs and upper management considering management got rid of his top assistant this past offseason without even consulting Thibs.

Now you add in that management took away Thibs favorite player, in addition to the Owner calling the team mediocre and its like they are trying piss him off. I loved the Deng trade so I agree with management there, but then to insult the team publicly is no bueno.

I love Thibs and hope he sticks around but from the outside it sounds like management is trying to piss all over him this year.

That said, I think Thibs motivates players a different way then what other "effort" coaches do. I think he frames it in a way that basically he tells them "you're a professional basketball player and this team is your family. You either play to your potential or you're riding the bench." Also add into the fact that he's gotten players such a Asik, Taj, Korver, Belinelli and Nate Robinson to buy and subsequently get paid and you can see why the players buy in so much.

I'm not entirely sure that his "message" is entirely different than other effort coaches. "Play hard or sit" seems common.

I think what helped Chicago so much was that the top player(s) bought into the system. They have more clout and pull than any coach has in the NBA. When the stars buy in... the Nate Robinsons, Asiks, Korvers, et al have no choice if they want to stick around.